Thievery

[Grog]

just call it "the family" ^^

[Jackard]

Moved to Congress.

[Zamte]

The only problem is that you're idealizing the way you feel the other side ought to act in order to validate how you feel about what you do.

Yes, it's a game, and yes, it should be fun, but the fact remains that any time spent here is real world time. Any effort put in here, is real world effort. I can come here, and have fun playing the game, but if what I have played (and yes, worked too. Effort is work.) for is taken from me, then it is a loss of my time, both in game and in the real world. I think that stupid statement "In the real world" is part of the problem here. Stop kidding yourself people. The internet is not some fantasy land totally separated from Earth, or the physical plane. It IS a part of the real world. It takes time from the real world, effort from the real world, and you must choose to do it instead of other things in the real world. For this reason, when you ruin other people's fun for your own enjoyment, they do get upset, in the real world.

I understand theft is part of the game, but you need to understand that by thieving, vandalizing, murdering, or raiding, you are deriving your fun from destroying the fun of other players. It's the fact that you could enjoy the game your own way without harming anybody else, but choose to be either lazy (by not doing it yourself and instead stealing), or just a jerk (by ruining their fun for your own pleasure) that people then hold it against you.

You can be a thief, a murderer, a raider, whatever you choose. Feel free. However you cannot try to pretend that you are just some innocent guy playing the game. You're deriving your fun from ruining theirs, and there's no escaping that fact.

[burgingham]

I think that stupid statement "In the real world" is part of the problem here. Stop kidding yourself people. The internet is not some fantasy land totally separated from Earth, or the physical plane. It IS a part of the real world. It takes time from the real world, effort from the real world, and you must choose to do it instead of other things in the real world. For this reason, when you ruin other people's fun for your own enjoyment, they do get upset, in the real world.

This is a very interesting statement which people and science have put way too less effort into. The real meaning of this statement might stay hidden for quite some time, but this might go too far for such a thread.

[Jackard]

I think that stupid statement "In the real world" is part of the problem here. Stop kidding yourself people. The internet is not some fantasy land totally separated from Earth, or the physical plane. It IS a part of the real world. It takes time from the real world, effort from the real world, and you must choose to do it instead of other things in the real world. For this reason, when you ruin other people's fun for your own enjoyment, they do get upset, in the real world.

hahaha

[burgingham]

Do you ever care to explain yourself? Or is this part of a superior attitude to hide your real knowledge in the shadows?

[Zamte]

I was thinking about it as I wrote it, and the reality is there's really no way I can think of to actually create a totally seperate virtual world. Even if you could upload yourself to it, it'd be a machine which needs maintained, and is limited by it's own potential. You might be able to alter your perception of time, but things could only happen so quickly due to the machine's speeds.

In any case, the point remains... If I decide to spend the weekend working on planting a whole grove of new, nice trees to use for fuel, then some newbie comes by and decides to cut them down (I obviously would put them on my claim/in village, but for sake of example...) then while I may have had fun, and it may have been my choice, the weekend is for naught. The same goes for anything that a thief, murderer, or raider does. They're undoing something somebody else took time and effort to do.

[theTrav]

But what if it was a machine that designed and built new machines?

[Pansy]

Supposing a thief got into your village, broke into your vault and in the strong box where you left your steel left in its place an equal number of poppy flowers? No animals killed, no characters murdered, just a hole in your brick wall, a hole in your pallisade and your strong box lock broken.

Or supposing the thief left instead of the poppy flowers a ransom note. (Actually three pieces of parchment because he couldn't give full instructions on one piece.)

Or supposing the invader got into your cabin where you were sleeping and left in the basket beside your hearth a thief scent that you had left when retreiving property stolen in an early unrelated raid. How would you react when you found that scent?

Most of the people who play black hats in this game are particularly clumsy in their game play. Yes, it makes sense to destroy your opponent's infrastructure and attack him before he can attack you, but the great number of raids that destroy the crops and livestock and throw property on the ground so it will disappear are done to vulnerable villages in their early stages when they have just managed to get property worth owning, but not managed to build up some defenses, and the attack is done by someone they are at best only vaguely aware of and in the majority of cases had no intention of becoming the enemy of. It's not pre-emptive because the ones who are attacked are not building up to be raiders.

Basically, most of the thieves and raiders are just throwing their weight around and in the process impressing nobody. And it is a pity. This game has such potential! Has anyone taken a hostage and presented themself at a village gate demanding it be opened or they will kill their victim? Has anyone issued a challenge to a friend: "Get into my village and get the chest of cave bulbs I am holding there. See if you can do it!" Has anyone tried stealing high q stuff and substituting lower q stuff to trick the owner into not realising there has been a theft? The gaming potential for a clever rogue is enormous. But it doesn't seem to be happening.

[Jackard]

Basically, most of the thieves and raiders are just throwing their weight around and in the process impressing nobody. And it is a pity. This game has such potential! Has anyone taken a hostage and presented themself at a village gate demanding it be opened or they will kill their victim? Has anyone issued a challenge to a friend: "Get into my village and get the chest of cave bulbs I am holding there. See if you can do it!" Has anyone tried stealing high q stuff and substituting lower q stuff to trick the owner into not realising there has been a theft? The gaming potential for a clever rogue is enormous. But it doesn't seem to be happening.

How are players supposed to keep someone hostage long enough to receive a ransom?