Dungeons/Caves/New enemies

[shockedfrog]

In my experience that kind of thing never really works well for solo players as most groups are reluctant to let most outsiders in except in those cases where there's not enough of them online and they're really desperate. Solo players end up in groups with each other that fail so badly because everyones styles are incompatible and it becomes obvious why they chose to be solo players in the first place.

[theTrav]

Well, I guess them's the breaks. You could always spend a lot of time making steel to trade for the monster parts, so long as weapons and armor breaks steel will always be valuable

[shockedfrog]

I can't really imagine a trade like that working, though the whole thing is very vague right now. I'm just not a fan of the whole rare item thing at all, basically, I believe in doing more with less.

[Devour]

WEll, if I understand rightly, they're planning on making it so that - if you set up in an area of lots of X, you'll probably have less of Y. So, if you manage to find someone that needs X, but has lots of Z, you could probably grab your cart and trade with them.

[shockedfrog]

That's true, but if someone has Q, then they'd be total idiots to trade it for X/Y/Z because there will probably still be demand to trade for their Y/Z/X.

[Cejer]

Indeed. Shockfrog is referring to the Turnip, Gold, Soul market system (I learned about it from D&D). In a nutshell, while everybody needs stuff from the turnip market, nothing you can buy there is ever worth anything in the gold market. While most people are involved in the gold market, nothing you can buy there is ever worth anything in the soul market. And only the top few people are involved in the soul market, and they never trade those goods for things in the gold or turnip market. If any inter-market trades happen, it's because somebody is getting ripped off.

Such a system is already in place. Go and try trading apples for a piece of wrought iron. It doesn't matter how many apples you have, nobody is going to trade rare wrought iron for cheap apples. Apples belong in the turnip market, and wrought iron is in the gold market (or maybe soul).

I would suggest that solo players should always have a few ways to get involved in every market, otherwise large sections of the game are closed to them.

[jorb]

Indeed. Shockfrog is referring to the Turnip, Gold, Soul market system (I learned about it from D&D). In a nutshell, while everybody needs stuff from the turnip market, nothing you can buy there is ever worth anything in the gold market. While most people are involved in the gold market, nothing you can buy there is ever worth anything in the soul market. And only the top few people are involved in the soul market, and they never trade those goods for things in the gold or turnip market. If any inter-market trades happen, it's because somebody is getting ripped off.

Such a system is already in place. Go and try trading apples for a piece of wrought iron. It doesn't matter how many apples you have, nobody is going to trade rare wrought iron for cheap apples. Apples belong in the turnip market, and wrought iron is in the gold market (or maybe soul).

I would suggest that solo players should always have a few ways to get involved in every market, otherwise large sections of the game are closed to them.

Given a currency, I believe anything could be valued in terms of that. Our plan is to create a coining press which can turn (any, or most) bars of metal into, say, 99 coins of said metal. 100 coins could then be put into a smelter and become a bar of metal again.

Of course apples aren't worth anything, anyone can get them without much material investment in time or effort. Bread, on the other hand? I believe bread has a measurable value. I believe apples have to, on account of the time it does take to pick them, but probably too small to be measured. A couple of apples for one cast iron coin? I could see a trade like that happening without "rip off".

New players, of course, won't be able to buy a Battleaxe with their apples, or whatever they may have gotten a hold of, but then again very few people can afford a Lamborghini.

And it will be a stormy night in Pleasantville before I introduce fiat currencies in Haven. The beauty of make believe is that you can eliminate some of the less pleasurable aspects of RL.

And, yes, it could be a bundle of fun if nations, for example, could strike coins with their names on them. There are, however, some problems related to that. We'll see.

And, also, there will be no attempts by us to try and regulate the value of in game items (Coins included). The hopeless futility of "plan economy" (A form of socioeconomic system, thusly named because of its rampant lack of planning) is no less real in a game than it is in real life.

[StarChaser]

That's why I love this game. It is player run. Games like WoW and RuneScape rely to heavily on the pre-set land scape and NPCs telling you what to do. In H&H you (or will be able to) make the landscape, cities, nations, wars, quests, currency and pretty much everything. You guys are giving us players the tools and we are building with them. In the next few years this game will be something great.

[Devour]

See, in a game like this, the value of something is measured by it's weight / how many slots it takes up compared to it's usefulness.

Bread and apples take up the same amount of slots, but bread is far more useful, since it restores more hunger. It's also rarer, because of the difficulty of making it.

[sami1337]

Indeed. Shockfrog is referring to the Turnip, Gold, Soul market system (I learned about it from D&D). In a nutshell, while everybody needs stuff from the turnip market, nothing you can buy there is ever worth anything in the gold market. While most people are involved in the gold market, nothing you can buy there is ever worth anything in the soul market. And only the top few people are involved in the soul market, and they never trade those goods for things in the gold or turnip market. If any inter-market trades happen, it's because somebody is getting ripped off.

Such a system is already in place. Go and try trading apples for a piece of wrought iron. It doesn't matter how many apples you have, nobody is going to trade rare wrought iron for cheap apples. Apples belong in the turnip market, and wrought iron is in the gold market (or maybe soul).

I would suggest that solo players should always have a few ways to get involved in every market, otherwise large sections of the game are closed to them.

Given a currency, I believe anything could be valued in terms of that. Our plan is to create a coining press which can turn (any, or most) bars of metal into, say, 99 coins of said metal. 100 coins could then be put into a smelter and become a bar of metal again.

Of course apples aren't worth anything, anyone can get them without much material investment in time or effort. Bread, on the other hand? I believe bread has a measurable value. I believe apples have to, on account of the time it does take to pick them, but probably too small to be measured. A couple of apples for one cast iron coin? I could see a trade like that happening without "rip off".

New players, of course, won't be able to buy a Battleaxe with their apples, or whatever they may have gotten a hold of, but then again very few people can afford a Lamborghini.

And it will be a stormy night in Pleasantville before I introduce fiat currencies in Haven. The beauty of make believe is that you can eliminate some of the less pleasurable aspects of RL.

And, yes, it could be a bundle of fun if nations, for example, could strike coins with their names on them. There are, however, some problems related to that. We'll see.

And, also, there will be no attempts by us to try and regulate the value of in game items (Coins included). The hopeless futility of "plan economy" (A form of socioeconomic system, thusly named because of its rampant lack of planning) is no less real in a game than it is in real life.

We could as well just brand iron bars to our currency. Which does makes alot of sense to me.
The only problem with that is that it would take up way too much space to store.