A look at Ranged Combat (Warning Lots of Math)

[Potjeh]

the leather is q160 (maybe lower but 160 is an easy number)

If you have a q200 stone axe.

[Windforce]

Are we taking into account 20% more Dmg from Full Martial ?

Does this come into play with Ranged attacks if so I'll edit my whole post. And that's kind of awesome.

Yes Full martial (20% more dmg) works for ranged attacks as well (At least in w3 it did, doubt they changed it).

[MagicManICT]

the leather is q160 (maybe lower but 160 is an easy number)

If you have a q200 stone axe.

You forgot the q200+ boards, too. I haven't heard of any water nodes over q100, anyway.

Cloakblade, as far as gear quality, you're more likely to get q200 steel before q200 leather, but then that just makes the numbers even higher.

[cloakblade]

Damn I forget how much goes into leather alone, 90q is what it will be (123 is 2.5 multiplier if that is more reasonable).

I'll add the martial beliefs to it and I think the math will start working out in the bow's favor.

So leather takes:
Stone Axe (tree and stone), Tanning Tub (Tree and Bone (for saw)), it also takes water.

My metal maybe a little low so keep that in mind. But then again sense to my knowledge silk only takes things that are farming related (essentially uncapped) it could increase much higher than the metal but this could be met by the fact that it takes longer to hit a better multiplier the higher you go.

[MagicManICT]

So leather takes:
Stone Axe (tree and stone), Tanning Tub (Tree and Bone (for saw)), it also takes water.

Don't forget the bark, but that can come from those super high Q trees you're cutting for boards.

My metal maybe a little low so keep that in mind. But then again sense to my knowledge silk only takes things that are farming related (essentially uncapped) it could increase much higher than the metal but this could be met by the fact that it takes longer to hit a better multiplier the higher you go.

Just remember it's easy to get your base iron up with a decent kiln and a good Q bone saw. A q45 kiln and q100 bone saw will make q35 charcoal out a q10 tree. This in turn will make a smelter of about q41-42. Even q10 iron will come out of that with around q22 which will go up even further as you process it through the steel process with that q35 charcoal. The problem is converting the bloom to wrought. (Of course, word is that at least one village used the bloom conversion to get q190+ steel in w3 by using a full nature character to work the blooms.)

[Sevenless]

the leather is q160 (maybe lower but 160 is an easy number)

If you have a q200 stone axe.

You forgot the q200+ boards, too. I haven't heard of any water nodes over q100, anyway.

Cloakblade, as far as gear quality, you're more likely to get q200 steel before q200 leather, but then that just makes the numbers even higher.

Although it's a real pain, you can use ever increasing plant fiber quality to boost tree quality over time. Also consider the possibility of a lvl 3-4 troll bone saw (with insanely leveled survival).

But... yeah. Seriously difficult to get. Just wanted to point out it's possible

[DatOneGuy]

It's pointless to consider those increases in quality as they also increase the quality of the armor-wearing folks.

[DatOneGuy]

Here's the numbers I'm going to go with: (90 is a nice triple, easy to go with)
q90 Steel
q90 Leather
q90 Wool (Four Leaf Clovers)
q90 Silk

Calculating Base (Same for everything q90, since all mats are considered q90 here, for everything)
Soldier's Helmet - HP 425 AC 50/25
Plate Armor - HP 500 AC 150/75
Soldier's Gauntlets - HP 150 AC 15/10
Ranger's Boots - HP 150 AC 15/15
Vapntreyiu - HP 75 AC 10/10
Leather Pants - HP 150 AC 25/25


Total value we're going to end up with here is: HP 4350 AC 795/480

Now while I've considered everything equal here (instead of just using my own numbers), I am going to be simple on stats, it is VERY easy to get PER, not so much with AGI.
(0.5 * (PERC / AGIL) * MAX-DAMAGE)
Bow q 90, of course like everything else.

300*sqrt(90/10) = 900
900 * 1.2 (Martial) = 1,080
(0.5 * (1200/600) * 1080) = 1080 (Always do max damage)

So from there we know that we will do 1080 Damage every hit, exactly 1080, no more no less.

Your first hit strikes the opponent and does:
1080 - 795 (Pure deflect) = 285 Damage, which is absorbed by your armor but damages it evenly across.
So now each of your six equipment takes 47 Damage.

Equipment now looks like this:
Helmet 1228
Plate 1453
Gauntlets 403
Boots 403
Vapn 178
Leather Pants403



(NOTHING gets knocked off with the first hit, chances are by now the person wises up and starts to move it move it back to their safe place) if they don't...:
Second hit, BAM!
1080 - 795 (Pure deflect) = 285 Damage, which is absorbed once again and split evenly across.
so now each of your six equipment pieces takes 47 damage, again.

Equipment now looks like this:
Helmet 1181
Plate 1406
Gauntlets356
Boots 356
Vapn 131
Leather Pants 356

Everything still in tact, if he hasn't run by now he's AFK and will probably die as long as anyone could get past his armor, I mean GOD DAMN right?
So now finally after that hit we saw the first item break: Vapntreyiu.
So now you're hitting for:
1080 - 765 = 315 (Quite a boost, but still taken care of by that armor man, that ARMOR!!!)
So alright the armor still takes the full 315, splits it across 5 pieces now for 63 damage each.

5 more hits later at the tenth hit, there go everything but the Helmet and Plate Armor, gone.
11th hit looks like this:
1080 - 600 = 480
300 Deflect
100 Soaked by SHP
80 straight to HHP
Next shot, probably dead. (If he had more CON add a hit for every 80 CON).

Overall it would take 11-12 hits to kill the average person with the 'average' warrior, but quite a few things would change, first off it's pretty easy to equip a guy with an good Ranger's Bow (2 nuggets, so 1 bar equips 5 guys, 1 cruc equips 10), you can easily have (and should) multiple rangers all aiming at the same guy for the first 'surprise' shot in order to take him down, this should ensure at least 5 hits at once meaning you now only need to wait to recharge for that second hit, taking out armor and one probably KO'd him.

Now I have to admit I originally figured the numbers to be higher, and maybe they will be, but as of right now you're right, they're pretty low. I don't know how trees are going to work, but assuming they're going to start passing 100 soon, it depends on how fast they start to hit 150.
Steel nuggets from ranger's bows can get more out of one spiral than you can in steel plates, you're not likely to find your average combatant in S3 Plate Armor, but you might find a village that bothered to make 2 steel bars of S3 cause they got super lucky. I'd make S2 and outfit 30(6*5) rangers before I made a single Plate Armor. Granted you'd need that many rangers, so eventually it gets to the point where you can get that, but you might end up with a `few` spiral1/2 out of a few thousand tries, you probably won't get more than a few.

These situations are what I would say typically push over the edge, I'm sure spiraling isn't as good since the introduction of Ore Q, I don't know. A lot of the things that people didn't account for that I used to use to my advantage might be gone, so I'm not sure anymore of Marksmanship is worth it (especially if you can't get your Arrows past q100 /150 or something, those are what matter the most for the speed of the shot.

[Sevenless]

Yeah, I never bothered to look at the math but that more or less confirmed my hunch that range combat is useless as a primary combat form. I still agree with something someone mentioned at one point though. In group combat there will be more weakly armored people that a ranger sitting in the back can mess with. I'd view them more as a support combat role than anything. Maybe something like 1/5 to 1/10 of your combat force sport 200MM for that purpose?

[MagicManICT]

These situations are what I would say typically push over the edge, I'm sure spiraling isn't as good since the introduction of Ore Q, I don't know. A lot of the things that people didn't account for that I used to use to my advantage might be gone, so I'm not sure anymore of Marksmanship is worth it (especially if you can't get your Arrows past q100 /150 or something, those are what matter the most for the speed of the shot.

Well, would you really need to spiral if you have a great q kiln, great q trees (for charcoal) and can find q100+ ore (on deeper layers)? Heck, I've tripped into q80 ore on just the first layer. Besides, isn't spiraling a exponential event? There really is a cap to how good you can get with this method in a given time given a number of workers (bots).