Sevenless' Guide for Beginning Players - Metal section done

[cloakblade]

Just get a wooden fish or rock lobster. That's what I do its easy enough takes a little longer but as long as you watch it you will get one fish. Maybe add in a clause about it in the fishing section. Something like: This can be done before gaining exploration but only if you already have a fully equipped fishing pole.

[MagicManICT]

It's not that hard. Boat building is 1500 LP, so you're already got more than a third of what you need for Yeomanry. The bark boat is nice, though, and will make that back in a day or two--assuming you're in or near a bunch of birch trees. The point is that you can't really protect your stuff without Yeomanry or spawning alt vaults.

Boat adds mobility. With mobility comes ants. Ants are the single greatest source of nublet LP in the game. That's primarily why I vote boatmaking before yeomanry. It's not a set in stone fact though, it's just personal opinion.

Sure, boats add mobility, but when everyone is running up and down the same lanes, the amount you find is greatly decreased. I find more ants, chants, roots, blueberries, etc. just wandering across land. If a person doesn't have a large area to forage in without crossing a river or lake, then I'll agree it's a first priority. The size of that foraging area should be at least 9 minimaps, preferably 16 or more. It'll cover a lot of different terrain usually and will get you familiar with the layout of the land and better spots to make camp.

I remember getting sting before having five exploration and if you do (and you have a bone) I'd say go for fishing before 5 exploration as it pays for itself after 1 fish (catch, fillet, cooked). Beyond that it sounds like my basic idea of a start I would love to know if you are going to add in points on hunting or make this more of a peaceful hermit tutorial I did see you get 15 UA (but not particularly to fight).

Debating the change. They'd need an extra rabbit for bone and string though. And at 1 exploration the string isn't exactly easy to find. Nor do I think they'd have a second rabbit by that point most of the time. Also, without a swamp (likely) the noobs would have to dig for worms. Fish are negative hunger bar when you do it that way.

I'm going to hold with exp 1->5 before fishing mostly for the hunger reason. They'd still be better off foraging and looking for more ant hills at that point than they would be digging worms and fishing. Easy LP is everything until you have a boat and a claim up. Then you start thinking about stats.

I'm going to have to agree with sevenless here. Fishing is pretty cheap, though. The problem is storing all that gear without a claim. If you're in a relatively empty area, the chance of being robbed while wandering or offline is slim.

There's nothing saying a player HAS to do things in a specific order. They should know more about how to solve certain issues than just following a guide blindly. Can't find enough food foraging? Put another point or two in exploration. Quit moving around at a run. (Not only does it burn more stamina than you can feed yourself, it wears out your shoes faster.) Stuff like this. The depth in HnH is complex enough that it's not like grinding levels in WoW. You're hit with so many problems early on you need to learn how to solve them, not just bang your head against the wall for hours.

A few other mentionables I haven't seen stated yet:

Mudflats should be mentioned for clay. Not everyone spawns near a clay node and the person will need to try most every possibility. Also, each clay type has their own discovery.

Those that haven't spawned near a river need to know how to effectively raid an ant hill. This is done by raiding the ant hill to get the ants to aggro and then kiting them away about 30-40 tiles (about the distance before the hill disappears off the screen). You can then run back (don't walk) and raid before the ants get back. You can then walk away from the ants until they get out of range and de-aggro. (This makes the idea of leaving the river bug in pointless.) Once a person gets 7 UA, they can safely raid an anthill without kiting the ants off. The caution being that they have to make sure they're defense bar complete regenerates before attempting to raid another hill.

Also, I'm not sure if it's mentioned in the "Welcome" thread, but the middle mouse button can be used to pan the camera with any client to increase the area seen and decrease chances of being ran over by wildlife. Changing camera options in any of the clients helps with this, too.

[Tonkyhonk]

There's nothing saying a player HAS to do things in a specific order. They should know more about how to solve certain issues than just following a guide blindly.

agreed.
having a good guide is nice, but walkthroughs are just lame.
do we need any more of those new players who never try to "think"? nope!
dont let them have too easy time on their first hand survival, one of the best fun in the beginning, although having too hard time on a stupid issue (e.g. getting off a boat) could be avoided with guides help.

and good luck to OP. looking forward to its completion. (and maybe translation for me later on lol)

[Sevenless]

Sure, boats add mobility, but when everyone is running up and down the same lanes, the amount you find is greatly decreased. I find more ants, chants, roots, blueberries, etc. just wandering across land. If a person doesn't have a large area to forage in without crossing a river or lake, then I'll agree it's a first priority. The size of that foraging area should be at least 9 minimaps, preferably 16 or more. It'll cover a lot of different terrain usually and will get you familiar with the layout of the land and better spots to make camp.

I'm going to have to agree with sevenless here. Fishing is pretty cheap, though. The problem is storing all that gear without a claim. If you're in a relatively empty area, the chance of being robbed while wandering or offline is slim.

There's nothing saying a player HAS to do things in a specific order. They should know more about how to solve certain issues than just following a guide blindly. Can't find enough food foraging? Put another point or two in exploration. Quit moving around at a run. (Not only does it burn more stamina than you can feed yourself, it wears out your shoes faster.) Stuff like this. The depth in HnH is complex enough that it's not like grinding levels in WoW. You're hit with so many problems early on you need to learn how to solve them, not just bang your head against the wall for hours.

A few other mentionables I haven't seen stated yet:

Mudflats should be mentioned for clay. Not everyone spawns near a clay node and the person will need to try most every possibility. Also, each clay type has their own discovery.

Those that haven't spawned near a river need to know how to effectively raid an ant hill. This is done by raiding the ant hill to get the ants to aggro and then kiting them away about 30-40 tiles (about the distance before the hill disappears off the screen). You can then run back (don't walk) and raid before the ants get back. You can then walk away from the ants until they get out of range and de-aggro. (This makes the idea of leaving the river bug in pointless.) Once a person gets 7 UA, they can safely raid an anthill without kiting the ants off. The caution being that they have to make sure they're defense bar complete regenerates before attempting to raid another hill.

Also, I'm not sure if it's mentioned in the "Welcome" thread, but the middle mouse button can be used to pan the camera with any client to increase the area seen and decrease chances of being ran over by wildlife. Changing camera options in any of the clients helps with this, too.

The issue with boats ignores the possibility with flotsam. I know they're rare, but a single flotsam literally boosts the player LP wise right to the end of the current guide. And without UA, water raiding ant hills is incredibly more efficient than land raiding. Not to mention it boosts them across more terrain. This will help them find dandelions and cone cows more easily. Thistles and Bramble coming with a little more Exp. I don't disagree that inland foraging is richer, but I still think water foraging is the way to go.

You do have a point about learning the land, but I know I didn't care about "quality of location" for setting up camp as a nublet. Remember the days of "Woo, Q17 clay!" ? I'm expecting them to setup wherever's convenient and close for their first timber house even if I tell them not to. I'm planning for this and later on there will be discussion of where to settle for a village claim or a decent hermitage.

Stuff about clay and inland ant raiding without UA added.

As for this guide enabling clueless players to survive, yes it does to a point. But that being said, this game is harsh. I know for a fact that there's plenty of middle of the road players who could enjoy this game but get stomped out of it for stupid mistakes early on. The start of this game is incredibly obtuse and requires a lot of effort or a lot of luck to get through if you don't find a village to help you. By helping the people who learn slower (lets face it the truly dumb ones won't read the forums or this guide so I'm not doing any harm there anyway) survive the first hump they can still be useful members of this game's society. For the smart ones I'm just saving them some time by accumulating the resources in one spot.

Oh, and I know about middling players who got stomped out personally. Had several friends playing with me and we made some noob mistakes when I first started. They got so disheartened by the death and chaos we suffered as a result that they moved to other games. I'm one of the couple who kept playing.

[MagicManICT]

The issue with boats ignores the possibility with flotsam. I know they're rare, but a single flotsam literally boosts the player LP wise right to the end of the current guide. And without UA, water raiding ant hills is incredibly more efficient than land raiding. Not to mention it boosts them across more terrain. This will help them find dandelions and cone cows more easily. Thistles and Bramble coming with a little more Exp. I don't disagree that inland foraging is richer, but I still think water foraging is the way to go.

And what's the foraging score (exp*perc) needed to see flotsam? Complete newbs aren't going to see these things at all. Other than for getting off an island or a 'safer' way to explore, boats completely unnecessary. (I quote safer because you give up the safety from wild animals for the chance of being killed by wandering murderers.) I understand the point of boating increasing the amount of land seen, but there's enough players that don't spawn anywhere near water initially. I think my first spot in w3 I was at least 3 minimaps away from the nearest water. In world 4, I was nearly two away. In w5, I got stuck on a large island and boat building was mandatory. Also, my argument above stands: So much of the riverside land is picked over by everyone else.

You do have a point about learning the land, but I know I didn't care about "quality of location" for setting up camp as a nublet.

My point about "learning the land" is so they know where the nearest swamp, grasslands, etc. are, not so much about learning where the quality nodes are. No new player is going to go searching for quality anything right away. There's just entirely too much to learn to throw planning two to three months (or more) down the line at them.

edit: Again, boating does helps in finding these different land areas. However, I've seen sections of the map in the past that are huge patches of one or two land types either inland or along a river. The variation was just the opposite--along the rivers in the area (which could be far enough away to be annoying) or completely inland.

As for this guide enabling clueless players to survive, yes it does to a point. But that being said, this game is harsh. I know for a fact that there's plenty of middle of the road players who could enjoy this game but get stomped out of it for stupid mistakes early on. The start of this game is incredibly obtuse and requires a lot of effort or a lot of luck to get through if you don't find a village to help you. By helping the people who learn slower (lets face it the truly dumb ones won't read the forums or this guide so I'm not doing any harm there anyway) survive the first hump they can still be useful members of this game's society. For the smart ones I'm just saving them some time by accumulating the resources in one spot.

Oh, and I know about middling players who got stomped out personally. Had several friends playing with me and we made some noob mistakes when I first started. They got so disheartened by the death and chaos we suffered as a result that they moved to other games. I'm one of the couple who kept playing.

This is why I emphasize about learning about options, problems, and what can be done to solve them. It really doesn't matter what skills you take first or not as long as the two key ones are taken: foraging and hunting. Given enough time, one character can do pretty much everything in the game without sacrificing anything other than in PvP combat. (I'm not including the losses from not going full industry or nature here.)

[Sevenless]

Flotsam only take a minimum of 11 exploration (with 10 PER) to see according to our best information. I'd expect it's really as low as 10exp, they're just rare enough that no one's reported seeing them at 100exp*PER. They're essentially designed for helping fairly new players get off the ground. Another advantage of boating is finding rabbits, which noobs actually want and collect unlike the rest of us.

I'll add in a section under the foraging heading about where to look for what when it comes to low exp*PER foragebles. I think we're stalemating on the discussion of boating vs landbound foraging. I'll also add a blurb about land foraging being richer and safer from players, but more limited terrain wise.

I'm also going to suggest at the end of the guide that people read through the comments that follow it. Lots of interesting discussion/viewpoints here.

[Sardy]

A good guide for those new to the game, keep it up Seven.

( First post on forum after an week of lurking )

[cloakblade]

When are you going to tell the reader to start mining? After they have a farm set up? While they are waiting for their Palisade to dry? I don't mess with mining much simply because so many other people do in my group that I never found a reason to.

[DatOneGuy]

I'm sure it's no priority but considering getting someone with photoshop to do the pictures for you.

[Sevenless]

I'm sure it's no priority but considering getting someone with photoshop to do the pictures for you.

Unless there's volunteers lurking out there it doesn't seem likely lol. Anyone willing will be credited of course. I'm aware the current images are... "functional", but it's all I know how to use lol.

When are you going to tell the reader to start mining? After they have a farm set up? While they are waiting for their Palisade to dry? I don't mess with mining much simply because so many other people do in my group that I never found a reason to.

Mining section comes after hunting. Bear cape is an essential for this after all. That being said, I'm breaking off from the chronological sequence and diverging into "professions" and/or village foundation. Might make village foundation a "profession" of sorts just to keep with the theme.