Underworld & Bear Federation (and it's neighbors)

[Malicious]

It is hard to know beforehand how people will react to your griefing/raiding if you pursue this kind of playstyle. Many will rage, quite some will quit (and probably never were suited for this kind of game anyway).

The ones that count are those taking it as a challenge. You cannot fight back? Grab a couple of friends, start hauling that clay for the brickwall, set up a metal production, make a badass sword and armor, then ram said sword up the anus of those guys that raided you back when you were a newbie.

As Avu once put it: "Revenge is the most powerful motivator." (Which is probably why wars never really end in HnH besides other factors). He must know since we raided him time and time again in w2 and he would always come back until the very day where he bashed our walls and transformed Wayneville into a pile of ash.

I already learnt quite a few valuable lessons for next time
My problem was that my brick wall is build inside the palisade and they're 22 squares apart to prevent snipers.
Thing is once your palisade is bashed you're no longer safe from rbows,

I'll have my full change character back in about a month.

[longblacksocks]

I never argued that Ainran were bad for the game, or that raiding was terrible and should be stopped. I was merely suggesting that this group of raiders were potentially made stronger due to support (in it's various forms) from Pande.

I stated in my original comment that i consider raiding as a legitimate strategy to take in H&H; it's potential is built into the core concept. Greifing people in an attempt to make them quit however is a different issue; but, do many people actually do that? I'm not so sure.

so i guess you have been lucky enough to get raided only by Ainran then?
griefing is sadly a part of this game, but taking revenge against high lvl griefing is nearly impossible by the current broken system - which most everyone agrees, even devs themselves. if you do not see what is going on, then, sorry but stfu.

whether you agree or not, like i said, its about balance for me, and its probably about fun for them.
i take it that Pande-Ainran coalition *may* be our last straw to defend against those russian raiders since most of the other major players quit.

It depends on your definition of griefing I guess. If you mean bug exploiting raiders and hearth vaults that cannot be invaded other than with bugs then yes, that is broken and of course needs fixing (many suggestions in the bugs forum about them). But people coming into villages and destroying literally everything (not using bugs) are always going to be in the game for as long as players can enter other villages and take stuff.

[burgingham]

The term griefing is widely misused in the context of HnH btw.

[Chakravanti]

Why is that? It just means to cause another player grief. That can really apply to any PvP but it tends to find itself in Clan vs. Clan PvP outside formal events. While it technically can apply to other things, those things themselves develop such a specific array of activity reference (camping, stalking luring, kill stealing, scamming etc.)that griefing just isn't used. Haven & hearth has some, but the culture tends to develop much more internally among villagers than other games because of the nature of the game and thus much discussion and reference to game activity revolves more around general references to everyday activity or raids. Any PvP that doesn't name itself with screenshots falls generally under 'griefing' atm. It's not abuse. it's just a unique environmental factor that hasn't excluded the term from more refined areas of activity and has rather created a converse situation in which every GvG conflict is of dramatic proportions.

[burgingham]

The generally accepted use of the term in gaming culture has a somewhat more narrow sense and at the same time is being misused in a way too wide sense. At least that is how I understood it.

[Chakravanti]

its varies from game to game and yes hnh is liberal with its usage of the term for lack of a better word to describe scenarios that arise.