Ainran still burning - PV clean up crew cleans PV

[Ogrim]

You are right that you that you are lying to whoever is the real life person playing the other character at that moment; however, it is lie related to a game in which there is no explicit rule against lying (EVE is a good example of this), which is why I consider a such lie to be inferior in the "bad"-scale to a lie related to something outside a game with such rules.

It is important though to note that both involved persons consensually agreed to play a game with a certain ruleset.

Alright smartypants. Since your entire argument is predicated on the notion that H&H doesn't have consequences for lying, tell me... where in H&H does the game ALLOW for lying?

The game allows simply for communication between fellow human beings. Since communication between human beings is bound by social conventions, such as the concepts of honesty and lying, the game simply passes on these aspects of the game to reality and the rules that govern human social behavior.

So to reiterate my original point. Please, STFU. No one buys your rationalizations save you... and even that is likely waning.

[Potjeh]

Stop feeding the troll please.

[leah]

You are right that you that you are lying to whoever is the real life person playing the other character at that moment; however, it is lie related to a game in which there is no explicit rule against lying (EVE is a good example of this), which is why I consider a such lie to be inferior in the "bad"-scale to a lie related to something outside a game with such rules.

It is important though to note that both involved persons consensually agreed to play a game with a certain ruleset.

Alright smartypants. Since your entire argument is predicated on the notion that H&H doesn't have consequences for lying, tell me... where in H&H does the game ALLOW for lying?

The game allows simply for communication between fellow human beings. Since communication between human beings is bound by social conventions, such as the concepts of honesty and lying, the game simply passes on these aspects of the game to reality and the rules that govern human social behavior.

So to reiterate my original point. Please, STFU. No one buys your rationalizations save you... and even that is likely waning.

No rule against it = allowing it. Which is not surprising since it is a sandbox after all, and sandboxes tend to give a lot of freedom to their players.

Your argument about "communication between human beings is bound by social conventions" doesn't hold inside a game like this otherwise "interactions between human beings is bound by social conventions" would pretty much condemn every raider out there. Social conventions are unwritten rules used outside of games, games themselves define their own rules.

[burgingham]

Stop feeding the troll please.

This. If you continue like this I will extend the warning to a ban. You are clearly trolling, which is shown especially by ignoring my valid counterpoints to your nonsense. The rest just ignore him/her/it.

[leah]

Stop feeding the troll please.

This. If you continue like this I will extend the warning to a ban. You are clearly trolling, which is shown especially by ignoring my valid counterpoints to your nonsense. The rest just ignore him/her/it.

I haven't answered all your points, but I have answered several. Let me quote some of them:

Following part

Furthermore people invest real time in the game and they pour real commitment into it. The relationships they form often go beyond what is happening in game as exactly this thread and its recent turn of event shows. If you deny all these facts as many of the reckless playerkillers do then yes you show real signs of a sociopath since you are unable to find any empathy for what other players have invested their time and emotions into.

was replied through

I do understand that people get upset when they lose something that they've invested a lot of effort into; however, that doesn't mean that they did no mistakes and they shouldn't take responsability for the mistakes they did.

For instance, whatever friendships formed in H&H, should evolve to a friendship that is larger than just a common interest in a particular game if both persons really want to build a strong friendship. It is also important that every player is very well aware of what the actual rules are in this game so that they do not get overwhelmed once another person does something "bad" withing the game rules.

Finally, it is important to realize that it is a game played for the sake of entertainment. If you want a strong friendship, find something else that can connect you both other than just a game with as much freedom as H&H gives.

.

As usual I have to mention that most of those playerkillers also broke the imposed set of in game rules more than one time to commit their crimes, which you conveniently forget.

was given a reply through

As for playerkillers: if playerkillers break the rules of the game, the persons behind them ought to be condemned in proportion to the offense they committed.

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The problem then gets even bigger when the logical chain of interactions is taken the other way around and in game events cause people to feel real hate or similar feelings towards the ones harming them. Very understandable though if we again look at the real investment into the game our before mentioned sociopaths chose to destroy.

was replied through

I do understand that people get upset when they lose something that they've invested a lot of effort into; however, that doesn't mean that they did no mistakes and they shouldn't take responsability for the mistakes they did.

For instance, whatever friendships formed in H&H, should evolve to a friendship that is larger than just a common interest in a particular game if both persons really want to build a strong friendship. It is also important that every player is very well aware of what the actual rules are in this game so that they do not get overwhelmed once another person does something "bad" withing the game rules.

Finally, it is important to realize that it is a game played for the sake of entertainment. If you want a strong friendship, find something else that can connect you both other than just a game with as much freedom as H&H gives.

,

I am surprised that so many of you are against this distinction of game and real life. In EVE, scamming is a natural part of the game and rational people don't think you are the worst scumbag in real life just because they managed to fool you in a game where deception is a major aspect.

and

Ironically, I am a very helpful person who does not grief in Salem, but does indeed track down raiders on request. However, I realize the distinction between real life and game. I respect that there are different gameplay styles like being a white knight, slave driver, raider, scammer, thief, trader, etc. without resorting to thinking that they are horrible human beings in real life. I embrace the freedom and role-playing aspect of sandbox games such as these.

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[Potjeh]

Please cut the derail.

[Ogrim]

Please cut the derail.

Yeah, I'm done here. I'm sick of bashing my head against a brick wall of delusion and rationalization. Besides... I'm barely a palibasher of ignorance, so this wall is beyond my ability.

[leah]

Please cut the derail.

I agree that it is derailing the thread too much, and since you also said "please", I'll stop.

[painhertz]

Please cut the derail.

I agree that it is derailing the thread too much, and since you also said "please", I'll stop.

I'm not sure why you haven't been banned yet, but I see it coming......

[Kaios]

Leah do you want to get owned again by the FORUM CHAMP?? U better behave or else...