Game Development: Haven & Hearth on Steam

[sMartins]

“Great Scott!”

Go Biggus, go, go!!!

[DDDsDD999]

I'm generally opposed, because the player base here formed largely around the idea of long term worlds working towards permanent ones.

I suspect the general player on steam these days is less the traditional MMO type and they prefer the new age survival genre.

I think we'll get a skewed response here for that reason alone, and although it may match player preference here, it'll be worse for the steam community.

Short term worlds seem highly prioritized for pvp-focused players as that's one of the main things that reduces over the length of a world. I doubt steam will attract many pvp-focused players, most interested in that are going to get their teeth kicked in many times by others before they can really be capable of fighting back. In addition, a lot of the marketing on steam is that of building and crafting, while pvp is stuck to the bottom. There's no pvp video or screenshots or anything.

Also pvp on default client lol

Personally, I think a steam audience would be much more interested in a longer term world.

I mean... it's not like you couldn't have a point here. Maybe steam should be long-term stable instead, and we should run quick and fast worlds here?

I think both being accessible to both auth methods is the best choice in the long run personally. otherwise new steam players will likely never know about whatever the 'other' is unless its explicitely advertised on the main menu of the game.

Having both options available on both platforms would be best. However, the devs seem committed to having only one new world upon steam release, to minimize one cannibalizing the other. I think long-term would set a better precedent for newer players as they get to keep their progress for longer, experience a more quiet time during mid-to-late world, and spend more time learning before they have to relive the world start rat-race.

[The_Blode]

Sleep tight! Expect 30+ page thread on waking up tomorrow!

Prophetic

[Robben_DuMarsch]

Short term worlds seem highly prioritized for pvp-focused players as that's one of the main things that reduces over the length of a world. I doubt steam will attract many pvp-focused players.

I don't understand where you're making this assumption. Steam does not necessarily equate to casuals. The top games on steam at any time are PvP games like CS:GO, DOTA 2, and it was the birth place of Rust. The latter two of which have notoriously difficult learning curves where you get farmed for dozens of hours before you start to hold your own.

Also pvp on default client lol

Is this your true concern? I'm teetering on the edge of thinking you guys are suggesting this because you're looking at steam as a doomed experiment, and you want to bop your steam newbs for one failed launch then get back to business as usual.

[HasseKebab]

You should take in mind that a central spawn continent like this world could be a terrible idea for completely new players since they'd just be steamrolled by the sweats of the community. Spawning on all continents would definitely give new people a better chance at getting anywhere

[Baldarich]

Short term worlds seem highly prioritized for pvp-focused players as that's one of the main things that reduces over the length of a world. I doubt steam will attract many pvp-focused players.

I don't understand where you're making this assumption. Steam does not necessarily equate to casuals. The top games on steam at any time are PvP games like CS:GO, DOTA 2, and it was the birth place of Rust. The latter two of which have notoriously difficult learning curves where you get farmed for dozens of hours before you start to hold your own.

CS:GO, DOTA 2, Rust is easy to learn hard to master tho

[DDDsDD999]

Also pvp on default client lol

The top games on steam at any time are PvP games like CS:GO, DOTA 2, and it was the birth place of Rust....Is this your true concern?

Haven is a lot of building/crafting/grinding for pvp that is high risk, rarely occurs, and is often one-sided. Rust is the only really comparable game. And Rust doesn't rely on client creators making a client, releasing it, and having every player download it off the workshop to have a playable experience.

I think attempting to lean into the pvp focused demographic is a mistake, especially since the devs themselves are pretty inexperienced with it.

[kimjungskill]

If the steam version of the game had increased multipliers for everything (2x for example for a 6 month world) it could unironically have merits for fracturing the player base and be a fun new way to experience the game. It would also likely better appeal to this new, expectedly casual, Steam audience. Obviously certain mechanics don't translate well with an exact 2x multiplier, but using it as a base for most things and taking immediate action on feedback, it could be a way to get started with it. As others have already said, you should really consider releasing on steam as early access if this is going to be an "experimental" version of the game as it seems to be and release the game as normal for your second marketing push when your experimental changes are more finalized.

Figuring out the verification/sub/store item account situation before launch should really be a high priority if it's not already. As someone who has spent a decent amount of money in support of this game, I would never make a store purchase again if existing purchases weren't carried over. A simple solution for the verification status part of accounts is to just remove verification status purchase altogether and build it into this base game (ideally) or transfer the current verification bonuses to subscriptions. It's honestly a cash grab that could just be recouped elsewhere in such a more well received manner with little effort (like making more creative hats, aka NOT another bowler/tophat/cowboy hat, or other equipment cosmetics).

You say, or at the very least imply, that multi client/account sharing was never recommended or officially condoned but the game is riddled with mechanics that greatly benefit doing this to the point that you're either crippled if you don't (faction/pvp play) or never get to experience the content (hermit). Credos are a good example of this. They are actually one of the better mechanics added to the game that span throughout early and mid/late game, yet you're actually hindered if you try to get them all on one character (+2 quest requirement per level per credo).

[jacob232]

It's amazing how after all these years you still don't know how your game fully works (shorter worlds but with same long timers on certain mechanics and their impact on gameplay), what players expect and how to prepare for the launch on Steam.

Don't get me wrong - Steam launch is great idea. But it all feel rushed, whole stream could be summarized to "We'll see", "We have not been thinking about it" and "It's experiment". That's not how it should be, expecially w/o EA tag. You try to get attention of new players, when game is not prepared for it right now w/o official and actual wiki or proper tutorial. You will get tons of negative reviews and word of mouth AND you are pissing off you current, loyal playerbase. That's a BIG FAT L, J&L.

Without my hatts and tokens I spent money on (and for some people - verification) I'm not intrested at all in S1. Neither plenty of folks I usually play with. But good luck I guess.

While this take is a bit Salty......They make a lot of good points.... This stream probably should've been W16 Restart and Steam Launch Preparations and Testing. W16 should've been used to test all the things we needed to like stress-testing and such. Would've given the community the chance to do what we WILL ultimately end up doing and updating all the guides and such. Would have also allowed for safe testing of Importing Seatribe Accounts into Steam accounts or integrating them wholesale like Runescape. Maybe get a better idea at what timeframes would be appropriate for World Reset and Production times. etc..... Im here for it reguardless.....but this is going to be a mess and you know it

[bmjclark]

It really just blows my mind that the devs have decided that you have to use steam to access S1. I'd love to do 6 month worlds but steam being required is such a stupid move for no reason. It takes what should have been an absolute win and just fucks it all up for no reason. Completely separating the 2 servers is so dumb and how you guys came to the conclusion that splitting an already small playerbase is beyond me.

Not to mention the fact that steam takes a cut of the money made (30% according to google) meaning that the playerbase will need to grow substantially for this to be anything but a loss in revenue. If existing players could still play / buy subs through the website this wouldn't be an issue.