Game Development: Prelude

[Kaios]

I'll wait for something that's worth paying for again before I suggest any other methods of payment, quite frankly none of this inspires me to spend any money at all right now or well in to the future until there's actually a reason for it. Level/skill caps mean that players will simply pay once they reach the first cap and not before it. If you debuff players who have passed the cap, paid but have been unable to pay again for whatever reason they would not be happy with that either.

[dvsmasta]

Here's Haven in 2008.



Clay Pits were actually still in the game when we first got players. I'm stealing it from myself!

We want beards!

[sym_kevster]

i would like to ask if you will be issueing refunds for subscriptions since when the subscriptions were bought they were for something completely different that what you are now saying will be.

i currently have a years subscription and i would not pay that for what the game is going to become

kevster

[shubla]

i would like to ask if you will be issueing refunds for subscriptions since when the subscriptions were bought they were for something completely different that what you are now saying will be.

i currently have a years subscription and i would not pay that for what the game is going to become

kevster

http://www.havenandhearth.com/portal/eula
They dont have any reason to do that.
Other than being kind.

[MagicManICT]

Sorry I only just saw this Jorbs/Loftar and I dont comment much... but this... well i need to comment on this… (BTW to be clear - I am not happy about the plans for the new world) - unless the plans change you wont get more $ from my family.

Your new model might work, but I doubt it. Limiting a toon to 200 max - limits the end game - I already had 300 str - and it was needed to be able to "scratch stone" in the mine. Even if you balance rock/metal... to align to the 200 cap it will reduce interest in the pure open ended nature of your previous versions of the game.

I invested in hopes that you guys would figure it out, I truly doubt you will see success with a capped skill model - with this type of "capped" play. Sandbox inherently should be sandbox - ie no limits no caps. That is exactly why I dont play WOW and other similar "cap" script games and the unlimited nature is why I did play this game. Maybe you could set it to 30 hours a week for free- maybe you just set the hours too low. Dev's... I get you want to monetize (and probably need to) but maybe the paid people could get other benefits... (and I hate whiners that dont give solutions so here are a few ideas)

Alternate ideas (could be bundled or separate ITEMS) not all are necessarily good - i am just throwing these out there.
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* no cap on paid - cap on free unlimited? (with the extra features being specific $ or one time $???) or maybe unpaid gets a LP "drain" the world drains you and paid doesn’t so gain would be slower and harder at higher but little impact at low levels - maybe combined stats = drain if you are unpaid? "weight of the world" type thing
* paid gives you respawn of some or all stats on death based on paid vs unpaid (3x and low paid and 9x at high paid) and unpaid gets little or none (or maybe %'s) – this could be an object that carries skill from the toon to the next toon in the bloodline – or could go to ANY other toon – life totem? (could be item or come with paid toon). Alternately an amulet that reflect skills from experience back to the PAID toon 1% at bronze, 2% at silver and 3% at gold? (or something like that)
* paid gives you ability to create a trade hub - unpaid cant create trade hub (anyone can go to one)
* paid can ride horses - unpaid cant or paid toons can tame horses unpaid cant
* paid accounts can make ropes faster or other "make item" things go faster for paid
* scrying ball for paid toons that allows wandering at high speed so you could scour map quickly (but limited uses or limited time) maybe uses energy - or are ITEMS that could be stolen or traded?
* x number of terraforming cubes that can move huge amounts of earth (balanced against manual performance)
* large "fluff" items like a dragon or demon or whatever that would "watch over" a village - but just be cosmetic / cool bling
* custom looking bling armor not available to unpaid
* special buildings only for paid (still would allow people to function)
* implement small pets - you could tame wolves to get dogs but ONLY for paid accounts
* maybe a "paid toon" - participant robe that gives an extra row of inventory (only wearable by paid accounts)
* paid account allows a personal claim changes the ICON on the map
* paid account has a slot for 1 claim to allow 1 more study slot - unpaid doesnt get the slot
* paid account upgrades a personal or village claim - slight increase in walk speed inside the claim for friends (maybe even select-able)
* paid account 5% increase in luck? (finding stuff - fate items ... not too % but some)
* paid account user can transform "form" to wolf or cat or bear - (doesn’t affect attack or only slightly or affects speed) unpaid cant
* Paid account can select silly bling like "glow" or "dark aura" - no effect just "cool"
* paid account gets mood music if chosen like aura - no effect just "cool"
* paid toons get funky night vision
* maybe paid account people look slightly different (elves vs humans? or simpler looking vs royal)
* paid toons can change what they look like (face/body)
* Paid toons can SELECT look of buildings - unpaid have to select materials to get color combos
* paid toons can PAINT buildings and walls and such - unpaid cannot
* paid toons can specify a new toon spawn point - unpaid cannot
* paid toons get healed by the TreeEnt things - unpaid don’t
* paid toons can create specialty furniture – chairs and tables
* paid toons can create specialty clothes
* paid toons can create specialty household items more bling; paintings; rugs; beds vases
* paid toons can speed up farming (or that could be a specific $ skill that could be paid for an account)
* paid toons can meditate to recover energy quicker w/less drain; or they just lose less energy

Consider selling in game items to bring in revenue (or could be combined to get people to go from silver to bronze to gold??)
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* ITEM: "skill knife" that levels = to survival (paid item that can be stolen - maybe unlimited or 10,000 uses or even multiple versions at various $ levels)
* Item and/or account feature: paid accounts start with flint/steel unlimited uses (can be stolen) or you can only make the unlimited ones if you are Paid or this can be an in-game "item for sale"
* ITEM: teleport stones or something funky that would not be overpowering but would give advantage (can be stolen/traded in game)
* ITEM: special symbel item (that could be stolen) that increases FEP % (not crazy but still nice for new toons)
* ITEM: special rings or broach or something that has bling like effect – cool but not too overpowering –
* ITEM: farmer hat that speeds farming
* ITEM: miner hat that protects from cave-in and speeds mining
* ITEM: amulet or ring or broach - that ups quality point by 1% or only 5 points or something.
* ITEM: glow sphere that lights up a mine better or lets you see into the walls for metal but only for limited time or limited depth


Other ideas on just general gameplay
* add filter device: cloth + charcoal can create water filter to improve it (or similar)
* add throwers trough "device": higher clay can be made from dirt + bone + water (or similar)
* traps– some way for hermits to protect themselves
* towers – that give ranged weapon increase % for all toons in them (think guard tower) again a bit of protection for hermits
* tame dogs from wolves that would fight with toon or would protect camp (maybe ONLY inside claim)


If I think of more I will post.

[ON SOAPBOX]
Why cap? I dont like the CAP - noneon in our group thinks a cap will fix anything - try something else. You took our money and then changed the rules. I doubt you are going to see a lot more people play because OH GOOD they will cap me if I play! woot that sounds fun! and oh wonderful all the paid people will be more powerful than me no matter what - that is sooooo appealing.

Consider some of the stuff above (or others throughout the thread)- the ideas might not all work BUT it would be better than caps - gotta let people play - if you need money get it parallel / supplemental - not hard $ up front that completely limits (chases off) free players.

I like the tree/plant growth rate idea too

0-80 100% growth rate for all.
80-150 70% growth rate for free, 100% for verified and subs
150-FOREVERRRR 30% growth rate for free accounts, 60% for verified and 100% for subs.


If you are worried about bots - who cares - if someone bots (and they WILL) just make it likely they will PAY to bot and at least DEVs get $ for it. Cuz its gonna happen IF you can get people to play again... be creative.

[OFF SOAPBOX]

[jorb]

i would like to ask if you will be issueing refunds for subscriptions since when the subscriptions were bought they were for something completely different that what you are now saying will be.

i currently have a years subscription and i would not pay that for what the game is going to become

kevster

We will not, but we will try to err on the side of generosity when we do change the payment system, to hopefully smoothen the transition.

[Zodiac215]

The two things i like most on H&H are permadeath and unlimited lvling up
Why not put the cap 50, 150 and unlimited for unpaid, verified and sub?

[Budfactory]

Ok, Jorb and Loftar,

I really love your game, but this is the second time I have used my time and skill to achieve a hermit that can mine, and then had the world end. This world hasn't even been up for a year yet! If you do not do something extra awesome for those who have been paying, and WASTING all this time on a game that is now going offline because you made a bad decision, I will not be paying anymore or playing this game any longer. I really have fun, even with the ridiculous collisions, and hours it takes to do one simple task...

This has really pissed me off this morning as I just spent more money on a subscription just to find out all of this work has been a waste of time. Affording $10 was a difficult choice for me and now I find out it was a waste of money. That is pretty fucked up boys.


BAD CHOICE AGAIN BOYS!

[slipper]

Just join a village, man.

[Ocerion]

Gotta also complain about the low "level" limit of 50/125/200, I'd suggest 125/250/500 combined with a modifier to how fast you get there. I will say that unlike a lot of people though I really like the idea, if not the actual numbers, behind the level limitations as opposed to limiting time. I for one will be at least obtaining myself a verified account for the new world.