Game Development: Inbetween

[Redlaw]

Yes I have a small grumbles about the new system, but when everyone else got pissed instead I started trying to see how it worked ect...

Amanda44 I have seen the dont ever change view kill a game, the player base was so enraged when the dev expanded the game. The dev packed his bags and gave it to a group of players. But people in that game even thought a spunky group raising from low ranks on the leader board was enough to raise hell...

I do not want to see that happen hear. Think positive what does this allow?

That plaid lumberjack shirt people asked, now it can be added no regrets, plain silk clothing, funny party outfits, whole animal mascot outfits (so someone can farm dressed up as a bear or something), and still compete with everyone else. Some peaces of clothing are still better for some tasks then others, which will mean people doing the same tasks will dress a like, but they do not haft to.

[Potjeh]

The RNG is hardly a little thing. It'd be generous to assume the average success chance is 10% when trying to build a piece of gear. The bonuses from gilding can make a huge difference, so you'll need to get a full set of specific category gildings (Agi and MC mostly I guess) to be competitive. As the number of gildings in a category increases, the chances of getting a full set on a piece of equipment decrease exponentially. If I remember my statistics correctly, with 10% success it's 1/(10^n) where n is the number of gildings in a category. Ie you're gonna be making 10^n linen shirts (what else is so spammable at high q?). Even if the success odds are significantly increased, the exponential growth is a killer. Hence why this RNG needs to go.

[jorb]

If you have a better fail state to replace RNG with, I'm all ears.

A system with guaranteed outcomes removes the entire problem of prioritization. Under a system like that you are more or less back in the situation where there is an optimal gear setup, and where acquiring that is simply a matter of getting the resources.

[Ysh]

If you have a better fail state to replace RNG with, I'm all ears.

Gild slots are static and increasing with quality? Allowing fractional slots, rounded to nearest. Affinity specific slots or affinity giving bonus statistic. Just thinking quickly, maybe some idea here can be good, I think it has been suggested before by others.

[LadyGoo]

I like the recent updates. Not sure why everyone are being so angry.

[Ysh]

I like the recent updates. Not sure why everyone are being so angry.

Not sure if you will play any other game, but players will do complaining if anything is changed always. Happy player do not do forum postings as much.

[Ysh]

I want an equipment system that does not force players into wearing too much of a particular look in order to accomplish certain goals.

I do want to say that I am not sure this system you have now can do this goal well. There are only two situation:
Looks and stats are entirely separate -> necessary to mean that all item are the same -> hard to make items will not get worn.
Looks and stats are not entirely separate -> necessary to mean items are different -> players will wear best item, as before.

There is no ''little bit of living in two worlds'' system for this. If there is literally any difference at all between items, player will make whatever best items are. If there is no (or virtually no) difference between items, players will not be making hard to craft item. There is maybe argument that really rich player can make hard to craft items to get the looks they want, but I think this is not most players (I think most players will play pragmatic fashion) and I think this is not accomplishing goal for players wearing whatever they like for looks.

That is not to say that gilding system is bad systems for doing the handle of stats on gear, but I think it will not be the ideal system for accomplish the stated goal.

[Mafious]

So, rather than just remove gilding which the majority of players hate, just make more of it and make it complicated ... lol, how to make awesome games and then slowly ruin them with each passing month.

I'm trying to advance the game, and make it better.

I want an equipment system that does not force players into wearing too much of a particular look in order to accomplish certain goals.

I, for example, didn't like how everyone in Legacy -- and here as well -- above scrub-tier, always wore more or less the exact same outfit.

Even though it has flaws -- RNG admittedly being one of them -- this system accomplishes that, and also introduces some distinction and depth to the various pieces of gear. It allows for the creation of rare pieces of equipment which are not unconditionally available to anyone.

Under the old system, there was no point in adding more shirts, pants, &c to the game, because no one worth his salt would ever wear them, as they could not compete with anything that gave a stat bonus, i.e. ranger's pants. This is no longer the case.

If you want to take a completely reactionary view, and argue that we should never try anything new, anything controversial, anything that we don't get 100% right straight away, or generally anything that doesn't get the immediate blessings of the vox populi, well, that's cute and all, but it is also a sure-fire way to never-ever in a million years accomplish anything new with the game, and that is not a type of "development" I'm interested in, and nor is the game in a meaningful enough state to merit the sort of feature freeze you are, whether you realize it or not, asking for.

If you sincerely labour under some delusion that there was some magical time in the past when Haven was great in some spectacular way, and that we since have been ruining it, well, I can't help you except by pointing out how unconditionally wrong you are.

We have recently(ish) added mammoths, knarrs, trolls, and domesticated horses. There is simply no point in the past where the game, on the whole, has been better than it is now.

I suggest you adopt a more constructive attitude. I want diversity in equipment, looks, and gear. You give me better ideas on how to accomplish that if you don't like the ones I have, but these sour-grapes you can frankly leave at home, because I'm not buying.

i would like to address olympus
- while slotting is a good way to personalize your gear, all (or most) items should have some kind of base bonus
- also number of starting slots should be affected by q for example a 60q item has 2 slots a 120q item has 3 base slots.
- fep and lp gilding would be a nice way to fasttrack the early game making new people get to know more of the game in less time.

[SacreDoom]

If it is equipment diversity among the players that is desired, I can at least see the reasoning behind making the current system. However, I think that the current system for many people devalues end-game equipment, as many people (more or less justifiedly) feel that the RNG is too harsh to risk wasting the equipment because you didn't get a new gilding slot, as it's much easier, especially with the introduction of the recycling mechanic, as I understand it working, at least, to simply use readily available and bountiful resources to make and slot basic gear until you get lucky enough times. If I fail to open a new slot upon gilding my merchant's robe, I will have a much harder time making another one if I'm displeased with the result than I will be making 50 pairs of linen pants and slotting those, despite their worse chances.

Also while I may be in the wrong on this, I personally feel that the introduction of the current system has devauled the importance of the quality of equipment. The softcap is annoying, sure, but it doesn't seem very harsh.

[Amanda44]

@ Jorb

I have no problem with advancing the game or adding new things and trying new mechanics - I have a problem with making the game tedious and for some sections of the player base virtually unplayable. And I'm not just talking about the gilding system.


I mostly refrain from saying anything too negative as you are well aware but I'm only human and every now and again I snap ... there are many things about the new version that I love, again as you are well aware and have spent a great deal of my time here over the years encouraging ppl to come and try it out, to stay or to try again.

It's not like I'm the only one here with issues about this system or any others you introduce, I'm fully aware of why you singled me out and yes, my post wasn't very constructive, lol, so I guess I deserved it. I find it pointless majority of the time to give proper reasons why or offer suggestions because you only ever listen to one section of the player base and ignore everyone else which is why the game never grows into it's full potential.