Game Development: Season's Greetings

Announcements about major changes in Haven & Hearth.

Re: Game Development: Season's Greetings

Postby jordancoles » Sat Aug 24, 2019 2:56 am

jorb wrote:
jordancoles wrote:One of these days you guys are going to need to bring the default client up to par because these unpaid client devs aren't going to do the work for you guys forever, even though it may seem like that based on haven's entire history


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I agree that the default client could be better.

Why does that highlighted part have you thonking?

Legacy Haven had Ender/Boshaw/Cdev and Apx/Richard Grey/Arksu/Xcom, etc. working on custom clients to fill in the gaps from the default client. Salem had Ender client again to do the same. Hafen has had Ender/Romovs/Boshaw/Ardennes/Shubla and some core Dis members working on clients for you guys. Custom client devs have been improving QoL/performance/UI in nearly every single world and across every single Seatribe title. Currently the only custom client that has been updated is Amber, and as far as I can tell people had to twist his arm to do it.

I see why the motivation to improve the client isn't there because of how much help is being offered up by the community, but it is clear to me that if the support for these clients was pulled, the playerbase would be cut in half. It's worth looking into imo
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Re: Game Development: Season's Greetings

Postby Chebermech » Sat Aug 24, 2019 5:34 am

It is indeed a huge problem, for me personally, I use amber client which kicks me back to login screen every 10-20 seconds when im near the trees after the update (even with the tree folder deleted from haven.jar), and I can't really do anything on a default client. For people who play this game for its sandbox elements, its important to have the ability to turn the tile grid on/off and have a normal perspective free camera. While its possible to change the camera through a command (unintuitively for new players), you can't terraform properly without the grid, its basically 3D modeling the environment, so free camera and grid is a must. Another feature that really helps is ability to hide the trees to see the animals or players without rotating the camera all the time. At least having an outline of a player or an animal behind objects that block the view would really help. And another feature, not as important but something that i use to satisfy my ocd is the ability to plant trees in the centre of the tile, if planting trees mechanics was a little bit different, like building for example, where you right click on pot > select plant tree and then you have this tree (or bush) show greyed out at 100% growth on your mouse, that you can rotate with a wheel and plant precisely where you want it at whatever angle you want it... that'd be a larper's ocd dream come true. And last but not least is the bounding (collision) box, something that I use all the time to calculate and build things more precisely to make it both safe and functional, when building race tracks or houses right next to each other, or any other decorations. This doesn't really have to be a toggle button to promote matrix-like game play, but its a very important tool for building and should at least be available as a command, just like :placegrid which is also a very crucial tool used for building. With all these things added to a default client i would be able to play the game the way i enjoy it, but without, if the custom clients were to stop existing i don't think i would be able to. Of course the are also a lot of helpful features and shortcuts on custom clients like ability to lower the graphics for people who don't own latest video cards and cpu, ability to enlarge the map which is crucial for pvp (current minimap size really is an insult to anyone who is serious about pvp), as is lack of key binds on running speed and over all only 10 slots for ability binds (on 1-10). Also something that would be great to have is ability to change the font size in chat... running default client on a high res monitor I can hardly see anything in the chat... I really hope to see most if not all these changes to take place during the client re-wright, everything noted here is only a fraction of whats available on custom clients but these are the most important things missing in my opinion.
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Re: Game Development: Season's Greetings

Postby Saxony4 » Sat Aug 24, 2019 7:31 am

jordancoles wrote:Currently the only custom client that has been updated is Amber, and as far as I can tell people had to twist his arm to do it.

Enders is updated and working fine.
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Re: Game Development: Season's Greetings

Postby bocia » Sat Aug 24, 2019 7:48 am

Herbs have seasonality,

great, i spend 3 hours looking for a kvann and finally notice it's not the season.
so i have to wait a year for a credo quest or abandon it.

can't that make credo quest won't ask herbs not spawn now seaon?
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Re: Game Development: Season's Greetings

Postby jorb » Sat Aug 24, 2019 7:59 am

jordancoles wrote:I see why the motivation to improve the client isn't there because of how much help is being offered up by the community, but it is clear to me that if the support for these clients was pulled, the playerbase would be cut in half. It's worth looking into imo


Don't really disagree. What features are essential?
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Re: Game Development: Season's Greetings

Postby Amanda44 » Sat Aug 24, 2019 8:01 am

T0ne wrote: Is there a plan to add more content or mechanics that add to the game/player experience rather than subtract or limit? (Aside from the direct implementation itself)

This now means if I need to forage or hunt for X, I now am not only limited by locality, but also seasons/time in general, before I might have to travel far, but now I literally have to wait days/weeks to obtain specific things? It also means I need to find more time to farm to prepare for winter, which I like in theory. But why not offset this by giving us a harvest boost of some sort in summer? +10-25% crop yield or something of that nature.

This would be a great opportunity to add some new top tier seasonal forgeables of all types, specifically curiosities to help boost the value of foraging.


Ants wrote:Maybe we could get some winter exclusive crops or a hardy crop that survives all year long.


I looked into winter crops and there are some more hardy types that you can grow in winter, Devs might want to add some of the ones we don't have ... Onions, peas and a fast-maturing variety of carrot are ones we do have, then there is also Lambs Lettuce, Asparagus, Broad Beans, Spinach, Garlic, Winter Cabbage, Kale and Brussels Sprouts.
Apparently you can also line the crops with fleece to provide protection against hard frosts, giving another use for wool. :)

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Re: Game Development: Season's Greetings

Postby Granger » Sat Aug 24, 2019 8:10 am

jorb wrote:
jordancoles wrote:I see why the motivation to improve the client isn't there because of how much help is being offered up by the community, but it is clear to me that if the support for these clients was pulled, the playerbase would be cut in half. It's worth looking into imo


Don't really disagree. What features are essential?

viewtopic.php?f=48&t=66294 should help to answer this..
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Re: Game Development: Season's Greetings

Postby jordancoles » Sat Aug 24, 2019 7:47 pm

jorb wrote:
jordancoles wrote:I see why the motivation to improve the client isn't there because of how much help is being offered up by the community, but it is clear to me that if the support for these clients was pulled, the playerbase would be cut in half. It's worth looking into imo


Don't really disagree. What features are essential?

What Chebermech said is a good start, but another feature from Ardennes's client which I have a hard time living without now is his waypoint system.
By holding alt and left clicking on the ingame map you can que up movements and travel long long distances. It made travel much easier and you could just que up an hour long boat ride and just sit back like you're in a Tesla
Duhhrail wrote:No matter how fast you think you can beat your meat, Jordancoles lies in the shadows and waits to attack his defenseless prey. (tl;dr) Don't afk and jack off. :lol:

Check out my pro-tips thread
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Re: Game Development: Season's Greetings

Postby wonder-ass » Sat Aug 24, 2019 9:11 pm

jorb wrote:
jordancoles wrote:I see why the motivation to improve the client isn't there because of how much help is being offered up by the community, but it is clear to me that if the support for these clients was pulled, the playerbase would be cut in half. It's worth looking into imo


Don't really disagree. What features are essential?


anything that lowers the amount we need to click.
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Re: Game Development: Season's Greetings

Postby pawnchito » Sat Aug 24, 2019 10:41 pm

jorb wrote:
jordancoles wrote:I see why the motivation to improve the client isn't there because of how much help is being offered up by the community, but it is clear to me that if the support for these clients was pulled, the playerbase would be cut in half. It's worth looking into imo


Don't really disagree. What features are essential?


Our village is certainly still affected. The potato mac user in the crew can't get amber to work so she has been inactive trying to get something to work. she used to log on daily but now hasn't even logged on to check the cheese. She will relent and use the default client but she said its just super rough around the edges.

I think the sensible player isn't looking for automation and full on scripting (although some maybe are that would be a detriment to the game) but wants the obvious quality of life items that the special clients bring. The thread granger has is a good reaction thread to this whole issue.

This patch is pretty neat in the little time i've had to play it. Its really pretty out and makes the world feel much more alive. well done on this im excited about all your major points. congrats dudes.
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