WW3 inbounddd

[shubla]

Well it's kinda hard to put their shit together when the west keeps blowing it apart. Blame for Syrian refugee crisis lies squarely on USA because they're doing the whole thing to get a pipeline through Syria. I don't think it's unreasonable to expect them to take care of people whose lives they've fucked up.

I dont care.
They dont have rights to take out my welfare because they feel bad.
Shit happens.

[Eemerald]

Fucking military operations.
The only reason why we even reach the question of whether or not America was justified in striking Syria is if we accept the troubling and unfortunate precedent that the United States is the defacto judge, jury, and executioner for violations of international norms.

I am no military scholar or statesman, but in my humble guesstimate, international civil rights concerns would best be dealt with by sanctions by larger groups of nations and the free acceptance of asylum-based immigration from the effected areas.
The only time in which military measures would be justified are in the case of defense of sovereignty, and when sanctions are ultimately ineffective at preventing some great harm to domestic interests (see North Korea as the only real, possible, example.)

Geneva Protocol - The Protocol for the Prohibition of the Use in War of Asphyxiating, Poisonous or other Gases, and of Bacteriological Methods of Warfare, usually called the Geneva Protocol, is a treaty prohibiting the use of chemical and biological weapons in international armed conflicts. It was signed at Geneva on 17 June 1925 and entered into force on 8 February 1928. It was registered in League of Nations Treaty Series on 7 September 1929.[4] The Geneva Protocol is a protocol to the Convention for the Supervision of the International Trade in Arms and Ammunition and in Implements of War signed on the same date, and followed the Hague Conventions of 1899 and 1907.


2013 -Russia and the United States, in their third day of talks in Switzerland, said Saturday they have reached a groundbreaking deal on a framework to eliminate Syria's chemical weapons. Secretary of State John Kerry and Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov stood side by side in Geneva as they set out a series of steps the Syrian government must follow. Syria must submit a comprehensive list of its chemical weapons stockpile within one week, Kerry said, and international inspectors must be on the ground no later than November.
President Barack Obama said in a statement that the framework "represents an important concrete step toward the goal of moving Syria's chemical weapons under international control so that they may ultimately be destroyed."He added, "There are consequences should the Assad regime not comply with the framework agreed today.

---------

Convention on the Prohibition of the Development, Production, Stockpiling and Use of Chemical Weapons and on their Destruction: As of April 2016, 192 states have given their consent to be bound by the CWC. Israel has signed but not ratified the agreement, while three other UN member states (Egypt, North Korea and South Sudan) have neither signed nor acceded to the treaty.[1][5] Most recently, Angola deposited its instrument of accession to the CWC on 16 September 2015.[6]

As of October 2016, about 93% of the world's declared stockpile of chemical weapons had been destroyed.[7] The convention has provisions for systematic evaluation of chemical production facilities, as well as for investigations of allegations of use and production of chemical weapons based on intelligence of other state

All the above unfortunately suggests that countries are actually bound by these agreements, or even give a shit about them.

[Potjeh]

Well it's kinda hard to put their shit together when the west keeps blowing it apart. Blame for Syrian refugee crisis lies squarely on USA because they're doing the whole thing to get a pipeline through Syria. I don't think it's unreasonable to expect them to take care of people whose lives they've fucked up.

I dont care.
They dont have rights to take out my welfare because they feel bad.
Shit happens.

They do, because it's your fucking fault. It's like if you rear-end somebody then claim you don't have to pay for the damage because shit happens. Except this is worse because it's intentional.

[NOOBY93]

Well it's kinda hard to put their shit together when the west keeps blowing it apart. Blame for Syrian refugee crisis lies squarely on USA because they're doing the whole thing to get a pipeline through Syria. I don't think it's unreasonable to expect them to take care of people whose lives they've fucked up.

I dont care.
They dont have rights to take out my welfare because they feel bad.
Shit happens.

hurr durr I live in a good country and have no empathy Xddddd

[shubla]

Empathy is bullshit.
There are many many people suffering. Its hypocritical to think we can help them all.
Of course If I was born in shitty country I would try to flee to rich and successful countries for money and stuff.
But I am not.

Well it's kinda hard to put their shit together when the west keeps blowing it apart. Blame for Syrian refugee crisis lies squarely on USA because they're doing the whole thing to get a pipeline through Syria. I don't think it's unreasonable to expect them to take care of people whose lives they've fucked up.

I dont care.
They dont have rights to take out my welfare because they feel bad.
Shit happens.

They do, because it's your fucking fault. It's like if you rear-end somebody then claim you don't have to pay for the damage because shit happens. Except this is worse because it's intentional.

What have I or my country done wrong ?
Nothing. Its not a problem of mine or my country.

Millions of children starve every year. Nobody cares. And thats only one of numerous 'problems'.

Life has been, still is and will be survival of the fittest.

[Robben_DuMarsch]

Asylum is non-economic immigration.
Think people fleeing German controlled territories during WW2.

[Potjeh]

EU wanted to get a pipeline to Syria so Russia can't screw with them every winter, and USA used CIA to make the Syrian war happen so this pipeline can be built. If there was no pipeline plans, there'd be no war and no refugees. All of EU bears partial blame, though I'd say USA is more guilty and should take more of the refugee burden (as opposed to none).

[NOOBY93]

i am very edgy

You do realize that "Survival of the fittest" doesn't mean anything in an ethics-themed discussion? When people talk about taking in refugees they don't do it to "survive" or for personal gain, but to help some of those who need help.

Of course If I was born in shitty country I would try to flee to rich and successful countries for money and stuff.

Stuff like survival?

But I am not.

This is why this discussion is not about you. Those of us who aren't sociopaths are discussing how to help the biggest amount of people while taking as little damage to their countries' structure as possible. The premise to the discussion being "we have to help them somehow", which springs out of empathy, so step aside and let your parents talk in place of you, they likely have more human opinions.

[shubla]

i am very edgy

You do realize that "Survival of the fittest" doesn't mean anything in an ethics-themed discussion? When people talk about taking in refugees they don't do it to "survive" or for personal gain, but to help some of those who need help.

Ethics is narrowly defined all about different viewpoints on things, like what is right or wrong and stuff. You can also think of things from the viewpoint of science and evolution.

Of course If I was born in shitty country I would try to flee to rich and successful countries for money and stuff.

Stuff like survival?

Its not actually true, recently the refugees complained about food that was given to them. They said that it was unedible. While the same food, or actually even lesser-quality one is given out in all schools, hospitals and elderly homes across the Finland.
If you are for gods sake fleeing from bombs hitting your house or in fear of getting killed, mutilated or whatever. You should be thankful for having a roof above your head and something to eat so you dont starve, with a nice plus of no one actively trying to kill you. Instead of complaining about quality of food that is given to you for absolutely free. Which is not that bad. Many Finns spend hours every day in queues so they can get some past-expiration-date bread to eat.

But I am not.

Those of us who aren't sociopaths are discussing how to help the biggest amount of people while taking as little damage to their countries' structure as possible.[/quote]
Sure they should be helped, but not by taking them to ruin our cool countries.

Asylum is non-economic immigration.
Think people fleeing German controlled territories during WW2.

If I had lived back then I would not have given a shit about them either. Actually, back then there was no social security in Finland. So I might have accepted them to come, as there was not much to leech from.

[NOOBY93]

You can also think of things from the viewpoint of science and evolution.

W..what? How are ethics and science mutually exclusive? Think of it like this: Science is the means, an ethical ideology is the end.

Its not actually true, recently the refugees complained about food that was given to them.

"The refugees"? Like all of them? Or individuals? I see this type of argument used constantly among the "fucc refogues!!!11" folk, especially the right-wing news. Take individual cases and make it seem like the collective (refugees) all do it. Stupid, but effective.

If you are for gods sake fleeing from bombs hitting your house or in fear of getting killed, mutilated or whatever. You should be thankful for having a roof above your head and something to eat so you dont starve,

Also a stupid trope among the rightwingers. "Their human rights were REALLY violated so it's ok if we violate their rights a LITTLE BIT!!"

Sure they should be helped, but not by taking them to ruin our cool countries.

That's the idea! Taking them not to ruin our "cool countries", but to integrate them, eventually turning them into useful citizens just like anyone else.