Coronavirus

[dafels]

December 2019: Chinese guy in Wuhan decides to have bat soup for dinner.
April 2020: The worlds economy crashes

[Sevenless]

I worry for my parents.

That part I can understand.

The rest... not so much. Which stems from the statistics counting corona virus deaths by simply checking if there was an infection, regardless of existance of any smyptoms or it being the actual cause of death. First in northern germany was a 73 year old with terminal stage cancer on a palliative (specialized on making dying as pleasant as possible) station, who as of the cancer was a dead man walking that went there to lay down and die, managed to pull that off and through this was promoted to have officially died of corona.

I honestly wouldn't be surprised at this point if someone who successfully suicided through eating a shotgun would too be chalked up as a corona death, given a positive test outcome on the now basically headless body. And as the resulting completely nonsense statistics are used as excuse to to remove civil liberties... Have a nice pandemic crisis.

Not being from the US, we have a different view on what counts as crucial civil liberties, and which ones count as civil priviledges that can be taken away in dire times of need for public order and societal benefit as a whole. And yet the US still manages to be more autocratic and oppressive than us, with the exception being Nazi rallies are illegal here. All of our actions being taken are already enshrined into law relating to national emergencies. The laws being changed are ones that let us put more federal money into civil aid due to economic crisis. The laws relating to emergencies have yet to be invoked, and the only reason why not is our federal government doesn't feel the actions they're taking need it to be invoked yet.

Beyond that, people with compromised immune systems are still worth protecting. My mom is one of them, but both my parents are old enough to die of the disease even if they're otherwise healthy for their age.

[Trappin]

China just closed approx. 600 movie theaters. The very same theaters they reopened last week. Oh, and the recently reopened bridges connecting Wuhan to neighboring provinces? Chinese police located in those connected regions are barring people from exiting Wuhan. People are rioting.

Why is it that our political leaders aren't calling for an international investigation to discover why the CCP concealed knowledge of a very dangerous viral outbreak - and then allowed thousands of potential virus carriers to board international flights to points around the globe?

Europeans convened a world forum to investigate the Chernobyl accident while reactor #3 continued to spew radioactive material across Scandinavia and Europe. They wanted answers. They also wanted access to the reactor and to view the damage.

The Wuhan virus death toll has already eclipsed those deaths directly caused by the reactor explosion and those longer term deaths caused by radiation poisoning/damage of internal organs.

Dear CCP. I want answers. Real answers. Not propaganda. And after all is said and done I want all of your balls in soup pot. And when the soup finished cooking I want the victims of the plague to shove your nuts down your throats.

[Burinn]

Why is it that our political leaders aren't calling for an international investigation to discover why the CCP concealed knowledge of a very dangerous viral outbreak - and then allowed thousands of potential virus carriers to board international flights to points around the globe?

Trump has been bitching about this for literally over a month. What are you talking about?

[Jalpha]

So what if there was negligence. Just look at people. Nearly everybody is being negligent and spreading this virus. Forcing people to isolate is harmful to the economy and society.

CCP blah blah doesn't mean anything if people won't stay in their houses!

The scapegoat in this one is the general public...

[Trappin]

What are you talking about?

Why did you refuse to use an online dictionary to look up the word "cribs".

Please stop stalking me, creep.

[MagicManICT]

So what if there was negligence. Just look at people. Nearly everybody is being negligent and spreading this virus. Forcing people to isolate is harmful to the economy and society.

Yes. We haven't had to deal with a serious plague in most of the first world in how long? We've forgotten what it means to have a mass kill event we can't control. People think it's not serious because the last dozen or so outbreaks have been kept regional, and if it did spread internationally, it was kept isolated to a few cases in a country. The last H1N1 outbreak almost became a pandemic, but it was somehow contained and kept from getting to that level.

Yes, forced isolation and quarantining is terrible for the economy, but is it worse than even a conservative estimate of 3% of the population dead after all is said and done? I'm not an economics expert by any means, but I understand the math, and what I've seen says we're better off doing our best to keep people safe rather than trying to let the economy run. It's not the first time in the last 500 years we've had a plague, and it's not going to be the last. (I think they're going to get much worse as long as world population goes unchecked. Especially when you add in overly suspicious governments to the mix of a global economy.)

[Burinn]

Yes, forced isolation and quarantining is terrible for the economy, but is it worse than even a conservative estimate of 3% of the population dead after all is said and done? I'm not an economics expert by any means, but I understand the math, and what I've seen says we're better off doing our best to keep people safe rather than trying to let the economy run. It's not the first time in the last 500 years we've had a plague, and it's not going to be the last. (I think they're going to get much worse as long as world population goes unchecked. Especially when you add in overly suspicious governments to the mix of a global economy.)

Working paper from University of Chicago estimates the net social benefits of social distancing alone to be extremely large.

I'm of the opinion that the administration in the US is filled with very intelligent individuals. That said, I have not seen a compelling to reopen the US economy in full by Easter other than a political one.

[AtoB]

what of your civil liberties have been removed?

Shit like this is happening: https://static.leipzig.de/fileadmin/med ... 032020.pdf - forbidden to work, forbidden to leave the home, forbidden to meet friends, forbidden to even oppose all of this politically (as rallies are also forbidden now, removing the only democratic means of the population to disagree with decisions of the leaders in a timely fashion).

One would think that the data set on which such decisions are based would be sound, to make as sure as possible that the mildest needed form of restrictiveness is selected... but it isn't, not even by far: please see https://videopress.com/embed/xw9WT7Zh?h ... k=0&loop=0 and take the time to read through the timeline on https://swprs.org/a-swiss-doctor-on-covid-19/ (available in muliple languanges) and the linked material.

To determine for yourself if voiding your Grundrechte is really warranted.
I don't think that being the case, but YMMV (though I hope it won't).

Beyond that, people with compromised immune systems are still worth protecting. My mom is one of them, but both my parents are old enough to die of the disease even if they're otherwise healthy for their age.

No one has argued otherwise.

The old ones are dying from this basically the same as they die every year from seasonal flu, with it being more and more likely (the plot thinkens, on a daily basis) that it is like that because this is just the normal seasonal flu.

Nothing speaks against doing what we do every year on flue season to reduce the chance of infection on an individual basis.

Dear CCP. I want answers. Real answers. Not propaganda. And after all is said and done I want all of your balls in soup pot. And when the soup finished cooking I want the victims of the plague to shove your nuts down your throats.

That you already have determined the result indicates that you are not interested in real answers. Which makes you part of the problem.

[borka]

what of your civil liberties have been removed?

Shit like this is happening: https://static.leipzig.de/fileadmin/med ... 032020.pdf - forbidden to work, forbidden to leave the home, forbidden to meet friends, forbidden to even oppose all of this politically (as rallies are also forbidden now, removing the only democratic means of the population to disagree with decisions of the leaders in a timely fashion).

I leave the house (buying food every 3 days - which is my normal habit btw.), i'm going to work in our electro workshop and repair stuff - while the shop is closed for very good reason i'll give the repaired stuff to customers driving by, and most of it i'm still able to discuss with my peers and still oppose many political and social ongoings ... instead of just bragging use your fucking liberties and prepare to grab the chance of a different mindset of many ppl when the crisis we face is calming down ... a lot of stuff has to be changed and now we have time and repose to think and discuss, develop strategies ... IMHO ...