Coronavirus

[MagicManICT]

take the time to read through the timeline on https://swprs.org/a-swiss-doctor-on-covid-19/ (available in muliple languanges) and the linked material.

Interesting article. Thanks. The problem is... who do you believe? Me, I'd rather err on the side of caution. I take the same stance with global warming. Maybe it is all fake news, but I'd rather be safe than sorry.

forbidden to even oppose all of this politically (as rallies are also forbidden now, removing the only democratic means of the population to disagree with decisions of the leaders in a timely fashion).

Yeah... it's too bad we don't live in the 18th century where the only way to assemble is at the town hall.... I think more political discussion and information is divulged via the Internet than by public meeting anymore. We could, if we had a mind to, completely shut down nearly all of the first world's government halls and conduct business completely online. We're just not emotionally ready for it.... case in point.

[borka]

The problem is... who do you believe? Me, I'd rather err on the side of caution. I take the same stance with global warming. Maybe it is all fake news, but I'd rather be safe than sorry.

It's one of those residing in swiss targeting mainly germans with their sided propaganda ... nobody knows who runs or even finances it ... (6% percent pageviews from swiss, 1,3% international, rest from germany) ... just part of a big network to confuse opinion forming in germany ... sucessfully as we see here ...

[AtoB]

The problem is... who do you believe? Me, I'd rather err on the side of caution. Maybe it is all fake news, but I'd rather be safe than sorry.

I agree with that stance, but to both sides: limiting exposure to stay healthy (as I do every year aroud flu season) and questioning authorities that won't let a good crisis go to waste to quickly push through more erosions of civil liberties - especially in case of them having widely visible gaps in the logic of their reasoning.

forbidden to even oppose all of this politically (as rallies are also forbidden now, removing the only democratic means of the population to disagree with decisions of the leaders in a timely fashion).

Yeah... it's too bad we don't live in the 18th century where the only way to assemble is at the town hall.... I think more political discussion and information is divulged via the Internet than by public meeting anymore. We could, if we had a mind to, completely shut down nearly all of the first world's government halls and conduct business completely online. We're just not emotionally ready for it.... case in point.

You might live in a different universe than I do, but the politicians here don't really seem to care about what the people want, unless enough of these are standing infront of the Reichstag, figuratively wielding torches and pitchforks.

To backtrack a bit:

Not being from the US, we have a different view on what counts as crucial civil liberties, and which ones count as civil priviledges that can be taken away in dire times of need for public order and societal benefit as a whole.

No real issue in case we really are in dire times. The main question is: are we really? Or have we just painted ourselves into a corner and re-evaluating would lead to loss of face for the ones who made the 'wrong' decisions, hence we continue on the initial path despite knowing better?

The problem is... who do you believe? Me, I'd rather err on the side of caution. I take the same stance with global warming. Maybe it is all fake news, but I'd rather be safe than sorry.

It's one of those residing in swiss targeting mainly germans with their sided propaganda ... nobody knows who runs or even finances it ... (6% percent pageviews from swiss, 1,3% international, rest from germany) ... just part of a big network to confuse opinion forming in germany ... sucessfully as we see here ...

There are quite some scientists from the field that oppose the official narrative, like Streeck, Wodarg, Bhakdi, Hockertz, Nida-Ruemelin (just to name some of the german ones that have been quoted with links to the respective source) that from their vitae look quite qualified to have an informed opinion, which they seem to argue comprehensible based on the currently known facts.

Do I understand you correctly in your argument being that their arguments are to be disregarded because of the website that is linking them?

[borka]

Do I understand you correctly in your argument being that their arguments are to be disregarded because of the website that is linking them?

Did i wrote that anywhere? But you have to be aware that they link just certain arguments and not even try to give a full picture ... certain experts views aren't shared there ... especially not those that argue against those that are spreaded there ...

And honestly why should i look at an anonymus page when all arguments are given at places where i can get the agenda openly?

btw.
https://www.heise.de/tp/features/In-Kri ... 92548.html
(german)

[AtoB]

btw.
https://www.heise.de/tp/featurese-Krise ... 92548.html
(german)

btw, do you remember this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wdjYwwV-Oss
(german)

[MagicManICT]

You might live in a different universe than I do, but the politicians here don't really seem to care about what the people want, unless enough of these are standing infront of the Reichstag, figuratively wielding torches and pitchforks.

Politicians are the same the world over. They don't really care unless their job is on the line.

have we just painted ourselves into a corner and re-evaluating would lead to loss of face for the ones who made the 'wrong' decisions, hence we continue on the initial path despite knowing better?

Oh, we have definitely painted ourselves into a corner, but the decisions have been made over the last decade, not the last few months. Just like the painter not paying attention to where they're going, national governments haven't been paying attention to what the true effects of future outcomes are going to be. Same with climate issues, same with so many other things. We, or rather our local and national leaders, are having to make these decisions because of the lack of preparation for a proper pandemic. We got complacent with modern medicine being able to treat or cure most anything that broke out.

[shubla]

https://www.expressen.se/tv/nyheter/gt/se-ambulanssjukskoterskornas-glada-video-som-gor-succe-i-krisen/

Meanwhile in Sweden...

[shubla]

Today I went to store. Precisely at 7 am like any proper citizen would.
Well, there was a sign that said that store is meant to be used only by risk groups (like elderly people) at 7-8 am.
It was the most awkward store visit since a long time! There were only old people there with me!

[mvgulik]

.
On the side potential interesting stuff. (self critical brain advised)

bigthink: 'Universal basic income is a brilliant idea'. Here's why.

bigthink: Edward Snowden warns 'bio-surveillance' may outlast coronavirus

.

[MagicManICT]

So there's now "open rebellion" (as labelled by at least one newspaper) in Idaho over the governor's "stay at home" order. Some of the more Libertarian thinking public have decided that such an order is an infringement on their right to free assembly. Which it very well is, but is the cost of a severe illness worth protesting over? Another notable fact about Idaho is the pockets of "fringe" groups that avoid, even speak out strongly against modern medicine.