Combat Guide by Flameturtle

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Combat Guide by Flameturtle

Postby Flameturtle » Sun Aug 30, 2015 2:11 pm

Combat:

Attacking Image things appears to be available after gaining the 'Will to Power' skill.

Once you can attack or are being attacked you'll find a bar with a bunch of different skills and may have no idea what to do with them.

Image
In this picture I initiated combat on a Mole.

The skills that you see correspond to your number keys. 1 will do the first, 2 will do the second, and so on. The second row is triggered with Shift + 1 - 5 instead.


There are 3 different types of 'Moves' that can be done, they are called Maneuvers, Attacks & Moves. They all have different effects, although some of them are similar.

Maneveurs:

Maneuvers are your defensive move. They determine how you defend yourself, the basic ones are Chin Up Image (Requires Will to Power) & To Arms Image (Requires Hunting) Chin Up uses your Unarmed Combat skill to reduce the amount of opening an enemy makes on you. To Arms uses your melee combat instead. There are a range of others which have fairly niche uses, although one that is worth mentioning for a big boost early is Shield Up Image (Requires Yeomanry) It uses a whole 250% of your Melee Combat skill to defend as long as you have a shield equipped. This is fairly basic to make, just 2 boards and 2 leather, and will mean if you have 20 UA and 10 MC you wil want to use shield up if you're wearing one as it would boost your defence equivalent to 25MC. Just dont get caught using this without a shield, you'll only use 80% of your MC at that point.


Attacks:

Each move or attack has colour-coded corners pertaining to the type or attack or move they perpetrate or block, for example:

Image
Punch has a green triangle in the top left corner;

Image
As does quick dodge. When fighting, you have 4 different openings, they have names, but they're not too important, they're colour coded to make it easier to understand.

The way damage is calculated is done at a few different points. For the sake of argument lets say your punch does 100 damage to the opponent you're attacking after taking in to account your strength and unarmed combat skills. The damage is then taken and divided by the square of the opening on your opponent. The calculation here is 100 * (0 * 0) = 0. Which means your first attack on a new enemy wil always do 0 damage. This is true for their attack on you as well, so you always have a bit of breathing room when trying to get away if they can only get to you once.

Your punch then has made a 12% opening on your enemy. There is a small cooldown on punch so by the time it is finished and you punch again the opening has reduced to 10%, so your 100 damage is reduced to 10 damage. 100 * (0.10 * 0.10) = 1.

If you had managed to create an 80% opening on your oppenent, then your 100 damage punch will do 100 * (0.80 * 0.80) = 64 damage.

The damage scales up very slow with openings until you get in to the 80-100% opening range.

Some attacks use several openings to do damage, and the calculation is in this quote from Jorb:

jorb wrote:If there are multiple openings matching the attack -- many attacks target more than one attack dimension -- the inverse of these are multiplied to determine the product to be squared to determine the final damage. Example: A yellow and blue attack, with a total damage of 50, hits a target with 30% "Reeling", and 50% "Dizzy", that is the yellow and blue openings respectively. The total amount of matching Openings are thus 1 - ((1 - 0.3) * (1 - 0.5)) = 0.65, and the target takes 50 * (0.65 * 0.65) = 21.125 points of damage.


Basicaly put, this means if you can keep multiple openings up they will add up to a higher one, good if you can't maintain opening past 50% because your opponent clears them too fast, however if you can keep an opening up in the 85 - 100% range then just stick with the one.


Moves:

The majority of Moves are restorations, which are used to reduce your openings. Quick Dodge Image reduces the Green Opening on you by a base of 20%, which be increased to 30% by adding additional points of them once you've learned the extras from killing animals. This removes 20% of your opening in total, so if you have 100% opening, it will take you down to 80%. If you have 60% opening it wil take you down to 48% Opening. The calculation here is 0.2 * 0.6 = 0.12 then 0.6 - 0.12 = 0.48.

A lot of moves can be used whilst moving away from or standing away from an enemy. This leads to the most common hunting method that I personally use, boat hunting. You can get in your boat, attack an animal, drag it out to where it can't walk out into the deeper water, stay a few tiles away and attack it every time you have brought your openings down to an acceptable level. For most animals up to boars, you can have your openings down to 6% and that should eliminate all the damage you would recieve from them even at low levels. For the higher level ones such as Moose, Bears etc I try to keep it below 4% if I can since their damage is a lot higher.

Some moves require you to close to attacking range with the enemy to pull them off, Flex Image is an example of one that requires this, and generally if it causes an effect to the enemy such as adding an opening on them like flex does, unlesss it specifies otherwise in its description, then it will take you into attacking range.

Initiative:

Initiative Points, also known and henceforth in this guide as IP, are a combat resource that you use for some more complex moves. To begin with, you start without any way to generate IP, so if you acquire a move the needs it, you're out of luck. There are a few different ways to generate IP, Quick Barrage Image requires a pointed weapon and gives IP whenever you attack an enemy which already has 25% + Red Opening and can be used with a boar spear at a distance so you dont have to get attacked back other weapons like a sword will bring you in to melee range. Low Blow Image is a simple move which gives an IP on a reasonable cooldown but requires you to get in to melee range. Take Aim Image gives you 1 IP at a reasonably far distance at an increasingly long cooldown the more IP you have to discourage huge IP banking. Think Image is pretty much the same as Take Aim but gives 2 IP on a longer cooldown and can only be used when you have at least 4 IP already. There are a couple other options but they're not great. These you should always be able to fit at least 2 into your deck to help with IP.

Martial Arts & Combat Schools:

Image

This is the Martial Arts & Combat Schools Page of your character sheet. Here is where you organise your deck to fight your fight. On the right, the skills you know show up in a list. This is from the basic client for ease of access, but you can scroll up and down once you know enough attacks and moves.


Info on the skills: Ring of Brodgar: Combat Moves
I used to keep a list of them here back when the combat was first changed to the combat system that involved the cards popping up with a chance to recieve different ones, but the newest system has full write up of the majority of skills and moves on the wiki, and I have been updating it recently to include the moves I've gotten from other animals, so best to use this as a reference for each individual move.

Clicking a move or attack will bring up its information on the left and explain it. The numbers next to each attack or move is the number of cards you can put into your deck for fighting. The amount of points you put in to each move is the 'μ' value, often it will reduce the cooldown as it will divide it by the amount of points you put in to it or increase the attack weight, meaning it will make you make more of an opening on your opponent when you hit them with that attack.

When you're done with setting up your cards for a specific fight, save it to a combat school. You can have quite a few of these but keep them right in your head, I haven't found a way to rename them yet. With this you can load up different combat scenarios very quickly, such as switching to pvp when you see an unknown or swapping to ant killing time when its time to raid. You 'can' swap during combat to gain access to different skill sets you have set up, however it will give a roughly 13 second cooldown. Not a problem when you're boat hunting since you can just sit in the water, but could be disastrous in a real fight for your life or when trying to tame a wild beastie.


Combat Discovery:

You will sometimes get a new move when you have vanquished an animal opponent. Which animals give what moves are on the wiki page listed above, but there are a few animals which give huge bang for your buck when trying to learn better moves starting out. Bats and Foxes and Badgers if you can manage them give a wide range of useful moves.

Fitting it All Together:

You will likely be wondering how you can make use of all of this. There are a couple of different ways you can fight, straight up & boat hunting. Fighting things straight up is dangerous, but it is required for things like taming.

Straight Up:

For straight up fighting, you will want to make sure you have armour in every slot you can make it for. The more armour you have the more damage will be deflected entirely and the remainder will be taken from the health of the armour. This appears to have been changed at some point, and I have not yet had time to work it in to the guide. If theres still damage remaining after that, it will be taken from your Soft Hitpoints - SHP. The main thing is to ensure you pick oppenents weaker than you for straight up fighting, if you're reading this guide and aren't sure of the combat system yet you'll really want to stick with ants at the beginning, attacking them one at a time to learn how things work. Ants attack with a Green and Blue Attack, hit them with a punch and they will attack you at the same time. Begin to walk away from them and use quick dodge and sidestep to reduce your openings to or below 6%. Once you have managed that, you can go in for another punch. Walk away again and continue this cycle. Eventually they will have enough of a green opening that you'll start doing damage, and around 30HP or so later they'll poof into nothingness. You can actually receive combat discoveries from ants so this isn't too bad a way to get started. Make sure to check the ant before you attack it as there are occasionally speedy ants that can run faster than your run so you will have to fight them and take some damage if you aggro them since you wont be able to walk away to restore your openings. When moving up to fight larger things like bats, which I highly suggest for your next targets, wait until you have acquired 30 UA and 20 Agility and atack one from some distance away. I reccomend doing this in a cave since you will be able to sprint after them once they start to run away. In this one, you'll want to fight without trying to run away to remove your openings and using a restore on them if they start to get above 40%. From here you'll just need higher and higher stats to take things on while not taking too much damage. The threshholds go up in roughly 10s and 20s, and there are lists out there for reccomended stats for straight up fighting but I dont tend to fight things this way unless I'm taming them. If you're taming a sheep you'll want 30/30 UA/AGI and if you;re taming anything else you can tame you'll want 50/50 UA/AGI although at this point you'll hopefully have added some melee combat moves to your arsenal so may want to start increasing that if you intend to use them, and remember shield up can give a huge boost to your defences.

Boat Fighting:

This will let you fight pretty much anything with 20/20 UA/AGI although you'll want to keep increasing your UA or MC to make it easier depending on what you're using to create openings. To begin with you can fight foxes from your rowboat, even just with punch, since they have no armour and will eventually succumb and you will be geting good moves from them. To start, aggro the animal from your boat if its close to the water and make sure to keep away from it until you're ready to start. At this point, if you're in an area with a LARGE peice of shallow water such as this:

Image

Then you can bring it to the edge and fight it there, since when it starts to run you'll be able to keep atacking in your boat and you can even get out ahead of it to force it back out in to the water if you're careful about it.

If you're somewhere like this:

Image

Then you'll have to re-aggro it each time it runs away. You can peace out straight away on the top right by clicking the crossed swords, then when the animal is ready to run you'll lose aggro straight away, and you can use your attack action to click on them and re-aggro, you'll have to be very quick about this as the animal may not still be interested in fighting and might run away, but if you peace it again, keep up with it and re-aggro they rarely keep running after the third attemp and wil come after you again. At that point you return to your boat and keep wailing on it.

Either way, go in with a punch and you'll take a hit back. Move away out of its range and bring your openings down below 6%. Move back in for another punch, and repeat. Eventually it will run and you'll be forced to either reaggro or keep attacking if you're in a big shallow area. Bear in mind if you're attacking it stil in the big shallows it may turn around and attack again. Keep going and eventually you'll get it down, and you'll have yourself some skin, meat & bones and maybe a new combat discovery!

A few decks I've used this world:

Beginner: Punch/Left Hook/Quick Dodge/Jump/Sidestep/Shield Up (Rest can be anything).

Coming up in the world: Punch/Chop/Quick Dodge/Jump/Sidestep/Shield Up/Take Aim or Watch its Moves or Low Blow, whichever you get first. (Rest doesn't matter) This will allow you to use your stone axe's damage to start making much bigger hits.

Use the Pointy End!: Full Circle/Quick Barrage/Quick Dodge/Jump/Sidestep/Chin Up or To Arms whichever is higher stat/Uppercut (Rest doesn't matter) This should be used with a boar spear to allow you to kill practically everything at no risk to yourself, as the spear will allow you to use quick barrage and Full circle outside of an animals attack range. This will even work for moose or bears as long as you can re-aggro them quickly enough.

Easy Street: Sting/Punch/Quick Dodge/Jump/Sidestep/Parry/Low Blow/Take Aim/Flex/Dash I use Take aim for initial IP gain then low blow after that since it makes green openings to help with sting. Parry will be growing the blue opening every time you get attacked and uses 80% of your MC skill to defend but you HAVE to have a sword equipped or its useless. Sting does 125% of your weapons damage so you'll start doing much bigger hits if you can put this together. You can start using this for bigger animals but with the more dangerous ones like bears I do tend to stick with Use the Pointy End! as it completely eliminates the chance you can get hit back and is much safer at the expense of some speed and having to re-aggro a few more times.
Last edited by Flameturtle on Thu Apr 15, 2021 2:54 pm, edited 27 times in total.
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Re: Combat (What I've Learned)

Postby Flameturtle » Sun Aug 30, 2015 2:12 pm

(Reserved for Animals)

Have deleted what was here and will make a new list of what stats I expect you'll need for straight up and for boat hunting.
Last edited by Flameturtle on Sun Aug 30, 2020 2:09 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: Combat (What I've Learned)

Postby Flameturtle » Sun Aug 30, 2015 4:10 pm

Shameless Bump
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Re: Combat (What I've Learned)

Postby MagicManICT » Sun Aug 30, 2015 4:22 pm

Keep this updated with all the information from the forums, and it'll get stickied. ;) I've seen at least one other thread.
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Re: Combat (What I've Learned)

Postby Archiplex » Sun Aug 30, 2015 4:54 pm

Since Archery is directly tied to combat we should talk about this as well.

I've killed a few ants as well but unlike your damageless encounters I've been beat rather nasty by them, and personally have 5 UA. Ants only use a few types of attacks, mainly striking, so they are not difficult to fight. It seems combat is much more rock-paper-scissors now, and is also much faster paced. OP covered up just about everything I know

Archery on the other hand is interesting as well, It seems bows charge much faster now, and do so at the same speed regardless of distance from the tile you're targeting. I haven't been able to check if they can hit things in between your target and where you are when you shoot (If a chicken was blocking your line of sight to a target for example). I am soon going to check if you can do archery while on a boat, and how animals react in deep water (I suspect they can't swim still, maybe bears?).

Ants seem to have around 60-80 health as they only took 4-5 attacks to kill.


I also suspect that no other martial arts/combat schools exist given that I've lacked the option to learn any skills relating to combat so far, meaning this may be all we can fight with, for now. Of course, there could also be the fact they could be learned otherwise.
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Re: Combat (What I've Learned)

Postby Flameturtle » Sun Aug 30, 2015 5:36 pm

Bump for large increase of information.
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Re: Combat (What I've Learned)

Postby Archiplex » Mon Aug 31, 2015 7:54 am

I've figured out some extremely fun bits of things regarding archery. Arrow paths will indeed hit other objects en route (I've killed chickens by mistake while out hunting.)

You aim in one of 8 directions, as long as you shoot in your zone you can direct it to be more specific. The may represent strength of the attack as well as accuracy. Here are some videos of my tests with archery.


When aiming, you choose one of the 8 directions. You can change it by sacrificing an amount of your loading bar, less if it's a closer direction.

https://db.tt/kzuWB0VK


Since your arrow will hit no matter what as long as it's on the path, you can spam shooting if you are close enough. I need to test damage done to animals using this method however, but here is an example against an archery target.

https://db.tt/znE92235

Though as you see, the degree of shooting can get VERY inaccurate.
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Re: Combat (What I've Learned)

Postby Zeler » Mon Aug 31, 2015 1:24 pm

What's about those green + when you hit an archery target? Are those some bonuses or just nothing importnat?
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Re: Combat (What I've Learned)

Postby Archiplex » Mon Aug 31, 2015 1:25 pm

Zeler wrote:What's about those green + when you hit an archery target? Are those some bonuses or just nothing importnat?


Those are just a 'for fun' score report when you shoot an archery target, they mean nothing.

See: viewtopic.php?f=42&t=40619
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Re: Combat (What I've Learned)

Postby Burritangoreborn » Mon Aug 31, 2015 4:11 pm

Good guide. I was trying to figure out which evade to use forever.
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