How does theft and siege work exactly?

[Barbamaus]

Hello.
I'm trying to understand how things like theft and siege in general work, but the wiki doesn't have (or I can't find) all the answers I was hoping for.

Let's begin with something easy: what happens when you steal stuff on a claimed property?
My understanding is the following: when you enter the claim, you leave scent of trespassing and lose 1 HP. When you take an item from a container or a stockpile, you leave scent of theft. Do you lose HP every time you take an item? Do you lose HP for opening a container or entering a house? How long does the scent last, and what's most likely to happen to you (get killed, ok, but how?) if someone finds it? The wiki also says you can use the scent to track both the player and the objects. How long can you do that for? I mean, could someone a week from now come find the items? Or does the scent vanish from their inventory if they gathered it earlier but kept it too long?

Then comes the siege part, which has more info but my math seems way off (or incredibly long). Let's say I place a wreaking ball outside a claimed land. The spot where the tool is placed is not claimed, but the wall I'm gonna wreck is.
The wiki says a claim has 60k shield points, and can only lose 4k an hour. But every hour it also recovers 1k, so practically you can only take down 3k every hour. If that's correct, it would take you 20 IRL consecutive hours to take down a palisade! How can they expect a player to stay 20 hours connected using a wreaking ball? Does using a ram change anything?
Also, do you need (and therefore leave scent of) vandalism to operate the wreaking ball if the ball itself is outside the claim?

One more thing: if to get inside I need to take down the claim shield, doesn't the claim become inactive (meaning I could do anything inside without leaving other scents)? Or does it still stay active?


I'm a bit confused as you can see. I'm mostly asking because my neighbour is not playing anymore, his animals died of starvation by now, but he still has some items I could really use. I know he's not gonna "track me down and kill me", but I heard there are people who do that even if the scent is on clearly abandoned places (which kinds sounds like BS to me), and I'd rather not die

[replikant8]

Every criminal action leaves a scent and takes 1 hp from you. Scents you leave can be tracked by other players when picked up. You can track both the person and his hearthfire, so if the tracker notices you are out of your hearthfire, he will eventually find you. Scents have charges, and once you use them all, they're gone. They remain on the ground to be picked up for certain time, depending on crime - murder scents being the longest lasting ones. Check the wiki for more details.

[azrid]

Put down a wrecking ball and wreck in 24h. That machine will not damage the shield. You will probably be fine no one is going to bother you for raiding an abandoned place.

[DDDsDD999]

Every item you steal takes 1 SHP, and leaves a scent. This means every item in a stockpile leaves a scent and takes 1 SHP. If you lift a container off the claim though, it's only 1 SHP, even if there's items inside.

Put down a wrecking ball and wreck in 24h. That machine will not damage the shield. You will probably be fine no one is going to bother you for raiding an abandoned place.

No, it damages the shield. You have to bash the wall every hour for something like 12-14 hours.

[MagicManICT]

That machine will not damage the shield.

As DDD says. This was implemented for personal use or as long as you have vandal permissions to be able to take out objects with soak without having to wait on the siege process (and damaging your own shield) from using a ram. Otherwise, without permissions, you're as well off building a ram if you don't want to wait on the 24 hour setting time. (There is that cost to build and repair to figure into a ram, though.)

[Barbamaus]

Ok, thanks for the replies.

I have another question, which unfortunately is only theoretical. What if I could extend a claimed cornerpost (let's pretend it wasn't sealed) out of the claim, and then wreck the unclaimed part? Would the damage extend to the claimed one, or would it only extend outside (or damage the shield)?

Also, wouldn't picking up a container be vandalism? or is it still theft?

[AntiBlitz]

Ok, thanks for the replies.

I have another question, which unfortunately is only theoretical. What if I could extend a claimed cornerpost (let's pretend it wasn't sealed) out of the claim, and then wreck the unclaimed part? Would the damage extend to the claimed one, or would it only extend outside (or damage the shield)?

Also, wouldn't picking up a container be vandalism? or is it still theft?

yes, you could, however you cant build on someone elses land, so you cant extend the corner post. no picking up containers is theft. Well actually just rummaging, until you leave the claim with it, then its theft.

[Barbamaus]

Ok, thanks for the replies.

I have another question, which unfortunately is only theoretical. What if I could extend a claimed cornerpost (let's pretend it wasn't sealed) out of the claim, and then wreck the unclaimed part? Would the damage extend to the claimed one, or would it only extend outside (or damage the shield)?

Also, wouldn't picking up a container be vandalism? or is it still theft?

yes, you could, however you cant build on someone elses land, so you cant extend the corner post. no picking up containers is theft. Well actually just rummaging, until you leave the claim with it, then its theft.

Oh I see, thank you. It makes sense actually that you can't build there... So leaving the claim with a full container is theft, but how many SHP do you lose? Is it just one for the container, or is it one for each item inside it (like taking a stockpile with a wheelbarrow if I'm not mistaken)?

[vatas]

Ok, thanks for the replies.

I have another question, which unfortunately is only theoretical. What if I could extend a claimed cornerpost (let's pretend it wasn't sealed) out of the claim, and then wreck the unclaimed part? Would the damage extend to the claimed one, or would it only extend outside (or damage the shield)?

Also, wouldn't picking up a container be vandalism? or is it still theft?

yes, you could, however you cant build on someone elses land, so you cant extend the corner post. no picking up containers is theft. Well actually just rummaging, until you leave the claim with it, then its theft.

Oh I see, thank you. It makes sense actually that you can't build there... So leaving the claim with a full container is theft, but how many SHP do you lose? Is it just one for the container, or is it one for each item inside it (like taking a stockpile with a wheelbarrow if I'm not mistaken)?

Moving container out of claim is single theft scent. Picking claimed stockpile with wheelbarrow will result in scent for every single item in stockpile (or at least it did couple worlds back.)

Building without permission is indeed disable but it could work if claim ends exactly at the wall and you let the wall you built to dry into dull soak (I'm under impression that non-dried palisade can't splash into fully dried one.)

Usually Wrecking Ball is the thing to go with when raiding abandoned settlement. Place it next to wall, check that "destroy" option is available (Wrecking Ball is not usable until it dries for 24 RL hours, but this indicates it has been placed correctly.)

[Barbamaus]

Moving container out of claim is single theft scent. Picking claimed stockpile with wheelbarrow will result in scent for every single item in stockpile (or at least it did couple worlds back.)

Building without permission is indeed disable but it could work if claim ends exactly at the wall and you let the wall you built to dry into dull soak (I'm under impression that non-dried palisade can't splash into fully dried one.)

Usually Wrecking Ball is the thing to go with when raiding abandoned settlement. Place it next to wall, check that "destroy" option is available (Wrecking Ball is not usable until it dries for 24 RL hours, but this indicates it has been placed correctly.)

I had that tested with a friend, removing my permissions from his claim. The w.ball only wrecked unclaimed palisade connected to his corner post (he extended it outside the claim), but didn't demolish anything claimed, nor the first two spots from the claim.

The palisade was built before the w.ball was placed, so the 24 hours to soak have passed since we could use the w.ball. Were we just unlucky?