Palibashed BW - I'm out. QQs and ragequits inside.

[LadyV]

And even if you are right, so what, psychopats must not be allowed to play games ? All they can do is messing outside ? Desabled people are humains to, they should have the right to have a game for there fantasies as long as nobody is forced to play it with them.
If you chose to not play with normies, just blame yourself cause you were well informed before playing.

Oh yes separate but equal has worked oh so well in Human history.

[Kaios]

+1!!! Stories! This thread is pretty good, this would make it awesome.

I can tell you right now that unless one of the people that actually played in World 2 were to post about it and regale us with the story, not a single other person on this forum actually knows the details. They sure like to bitch and moan about it as if they were around at the time though.

However, here is how I believe it would go:

Once upon a time in a world known as 2, a couple of shit heads thought it might be a good idea to call down a genocide upon a single, large group of players. Presumably their village mates went along with this because why not, what could go wrong? Their reasons for doing this certainly varied and I don't want to state something that I don't know so I can only speculate this had to do with how large the Russian population was at the time in comparison to English speaking and other languages. In addition to this, threads that I had read in the past from those worlds indicated that many new and not so new players alike were also initially being killed, reportedly by Russians, quite often. I'm sure lots of English and Russian newbies were killed and turned away from the game forever.

That's the story I guess, unless someone who actually knows what they are talking about wants to elaborate. In any case, this game has always had quite a large Russian population and even in world 3 I think they still made up half of the population and tensions between Russian speaking players and the rest of the population were always quite high but I don't think that is because of any historical events, I think it is just like Onep said earlier:

In Haven, there isn't that chance, it's just another faceless avatar to murder. I guess in short, it's easy to disregard the fact that other players are human in Haven due to the minimal interaction. I doubt many players would play the role of the bloodthirsty raider if they actually knew the person they were about to murder. It's similar to how war propaganda always works to dehumanize the enemy. If you're killing the kraut or the jap, it's not another human, it's just the enemy.

And taking this quote in to consideration it made me laugh seeing Apxeolog post this one:

For me you just another NPC. And your dialogs are too boring, hope game designer will change them.

I recall a post from 2010 in which a player says Russians are just like NPCs, can't understand a fucking word they say and when you respond in English they just ignore you and do whatever they were doing.

Speaking of which, @LadyGoo, I've seen your posts on the Russian forum and you are totally guilty of at least some amount of propaganda. For real all you do when you talk about Sodom/Pandemonium/Whatever is talk about the "fascist leader" and you even mention (don't know how true it really is) that he is a live descendant of German fascists! Mein Führer! For Christ's sake woman, what is wrong with you?

My point is that we have all done unsavory shit in the past that we aren't proud of (well, I hope not anyways) and I did try to make that point earlier by mentioning the account stealing to Apxeolog and you even bug jumped Odditown at the very beginning of this world so why the hell are you guys still holding a grudge? Clansman's post about not forgetting W2 even though he is clearly a player who was never involved makes me think you guys just listen to the bullshit way too much. You don't listen to Koya any more right? Who the hell is feeding all this garbage to the Russian players if not him?

[Jalpha]

I'm strongly against any mechanics which remove the freedom of players to do what they want. I hope restricting pvp is a path the devs never take. In a world where self expression is becoming ever more difficult for people who are different games like this one are somewhat of a beacon of hope. That unfettered self expression can exist even if only here.
I think in time the community could learn and adapt and manage these issues on their own without dev intervention. Maybe. Given a long enough timeline.
Seriously though these smalltime raids seem like an expression of frustration at being unable to raid a much more exciting target. Fix pvp don't remove it.

[Patchouli_Knowledge]

Freedom to PvP or not is probably not going to remove for any time in the future for the developers but trying to get that to work in the current setting as well as the comfort zone for many current PvP players is another story. A huge matter is trying to get the balance between order (safety) and chaos (retaliation) right, if it is even possible. Make defense too strong and raiders have a safe place to hide when not raiding; make defense too weak and watch raid start to skyrocket. Exploitation is mechanic can even allow said mechanics to be safe even when said equilibrium is towards chaos.

Also with the whole psychoanalytical subject, we are forgetting about people that loves to watch drama whether they caused it or not so when there is a lot of boredom, that is a big incentive to stir some drama up and what better to do so than to flatten someone's land. You can somewhat say that they are in the same league (not really) as people that watch Young and the Restless for the same purpose and potentially the purpose of the reason people troll (somewhat closer in relation).

In regards to the Online Disinhibition Effect, sure it turns people into jackasses but it can also work the otherway around that it can actually make people more honest (perhaps brutally so) than they normally would as they wouldn't be able to talk so in real life.

World 2 subject. Admittedly I was a newbie during the time so I couldn't follow too much of the storyline but it was said that the server and laggy and we need to kill players so they will quit and stop hogging the server bandwidth. Personally, I think it was just a straw excuse to go on a rampage. Hope they don't suck at kill stealing last hitting.

Finally in regards to Archaelogist's comment about calling Burgingham an NPC, I see a few ways to interpret that:
1. Him telling Burgingham, he is boring.
2. Him not caring Burgingham is a person.
3. Him using that comment to draw a response from Burgingham.
3a. "umad?"

I suspect 3 personally.

[barra]

Who are we to say killing all those Russians didn't improve the lag and crashes? Let's be honest, if there was even the tiniest chance of success, you owed it to yourself to at least try. Nobody can fault you for that.

[Patchouli_Knowledge]

Who are we to say killing all those Russians didn't improve the lag and crashes? Let's be honest, if there was even the tiniest chance of success, you owed it to yourself to at least try. Nobody can fault you for that.

As I mentioned, I think it was just an excuse to go on a rampage regardless if the victim killed there was Russian or not especially considering who spearheaded the project.

[shadowchris]

Who are we to say killing all those Russians didn't improve the lag and crashes? Let's be honest, if there was even the tiniest chance of success, you owed it to yourself to at least try. Nobody can fault you for that.

It just a retarded ass excuse by Klaue & co. to purge the Russians of the game. One time Klaue got really pissed off since he once again got killed right after dying. That and Stalingrad which was a big settlement moved into his area. And that reduced his hunting ground level to nothing. So he raided Stalingrad and some other place. That's really what I remember.

Fortunately W2 forums is still up. I say its worth scrolling through

[Patchouli_Knowledge]

That and Stalingrad which was a big settlement moved into his area. And that reduced his hunting ground level to nothing. So he raided Stalingrad and some other place. That's really what I remember.

Fortunately W2 forums is still up. I say its worth scrolling through

This event I wasn't really aware of during the time. And yes w2 forum is still around and (as far as I know) not in chunklets.

[burgingham]

In world 2 I was playing my first online game ever and yes I made mistakes there, because I didn't really think about empathy and the like back then

Then you can use yourself as an object of psycoanalysis, at least you will have a chance to make it right (because your attempts to analize my behavior are makes me smile). Tell us what you will find, it is very inteteresting (no)

Psychoanalysis is not the right word here. I also never attempted that, because I personally believe it is nonsense. I just commented on what you said yourself. Or did you not say you do not care who sits at the other end of this game? That is a factual lack of empathy, no interpretation necessary.

I personally probably did not have any empathy either back when we played a different style in world 2. That was more due to a lack of realization what actions in a game mean to others though I believe (because I had never experienced it before) and once I started talking to people my mind changed. Or how do you think I ended up in one team with Avu who hated the living hell out of me in world2?

Btw since this has become a topic on world 2 anyway. I personally never raided or killed anyone except two people in Xanadu (Jorb's little project to restore the balance of power in that world). Those were Niltrias and Cutlass, both of whom I ended up being friends with. The rest of the time I took care of the town together with Darki, we both never participated in any Klaue nonsense. That doesn'st mean we shouldn't have stopped it or set us apart from him. I certainly took that step too late.

[APXEOLOG]

Finally in regards to Archaelogist's comment about calling Burgingham an NPC

That was for Avu, because he compared players to NPC

Who the hell is feeding all this garbage to the Russian players if not him?

I'm not sure why do you think we dont have W2 players. You cannot imagine that not only your beloved burgi played in that times?

Psychoanalysis is not the right word here. I also never attempted that, because I personally believe it is nonsense

Oh i'd better stop our discussion from here. You seems to live in your own world (it is already obvious from your managment&manipulation strategy) and i don't even want to make attempts to crack the shell.