Mulch & Soil Balance

[DaniAngione]

One of the things I've been able to state since I came back is that Mulch is awesome. The Composting Bin is an incredible new tool - if not an OP one - and very helpful for tree planting.

I've talked about it with some people though, and we kind of agreed that a notable downside of it is how it makes soil quality - something that has always been very coveted and valuable in the game - kind of useless now. This is partially nice because we needed a way to "grind" soil quality for the end game but considering how fast we can get the first and fastest crops (like carrots) to q40+, I'd guess that even in a new world we'd have Mulch of higher quality than the best soil nodes (q40+) in a couple of weeks or less.

So, thinking about ways to make soil quality important again, I came up with an idea that might be interesting; that's up to you, of course
It obviously makes things more difficult but it gives some value to soil quality again.

The idea is:
it's not unusual to add garden soil or fertilizer soils (like NPK) to composting bins to accelerate composting or increase its efficiency.
So, what if instead of just "creating" Mulch from produce (quality based on the produce and softcapped by the bin's quality - how it works now) it rather "transformed" units of soil into Mulch with said produce? So you have to fill the bin with soil and it would now cap the Mulch quality (based on the produce) on both the bin AND the Soil provided.

That way, good quality soil will always be a valuable good since it will allow you to have a lesser softcap on Mulch quality.

An alternative would be:
instead of "transforming" soil into mulch, to have a second "fuel bar" for the soil so the proportion is higher than 1:1. For example, 1 unit of soil will allow 10 mulch to be created. Since one of the ideas of the composting bin is also removing the (annoying) need to dig for soil all the time as well.

Perhaps it could even function without soil at all (like now) but then it would softcap the mulch as if normal (q10) soil was used.

Anyway, these are just a couple of thoughts on Mulch's awesomeness and how it could keep being awesome but also give back some value to soil quality nodes in a next world.

Thanks for reading and please feel free to criticize

[MrPunchers]

No -1
I like my trees hq ty

[slipper]

Rich get richer, smh

[DaniAngione]

Ohh, everyone is so salty when you think about game balance as a whole and touch on their precious stuff

Careful to not drop those salty tears on your mulch, salt is bad for soil quality

[LadyGoo]

What is there to balance though? What is a balance for you? Equal quality for everyone? That didn't work.
The only thing that retains the noobs to keep up with tops is their farming atm, since you got seeds being sold close to the top q. everywhere.

[DaniAngione]

What is there to balance though? What is a balance for you? Equal quality for everyone? That didn't work.
The only thing that retains the noobs to keep up with tops is their farming atm, since you got seeds being sold close to the top q. everywhere.

It's not about equal quality for everyone, that doesn't work as you say yourself.

It's about giving soil quality a purpose again; resource localization is clearly an interest for Jorb and Loftar as "exclusivity" is what motivates both the good (trading and the social aspects) and the bad (wars and territorial conflict)
Having the soil quality matter for the end game wood industry may sound grim or stupid right now - in an already aged world where people is getting used to huge qualities of everything (again, like you said, it's easy to find top or near-top Q seeds) but it's actually healthier in the long run when a new fresh world starts.
Think of Clay, for example. Where even the "high end" craftable clay, bone clay, is still directly tied to a naturally occurring clay quality. Pretty much everything works like that right now, metals can be buffed by super smelters and coal and wrought iron crits but they still rely on ore quality, etc... What I'm saying is that Mulch grind is based on another grind that already happens (farming) and it "nullifies" soil and its purpose. So it's kind of an odd card in the game's mechanics right now.

Of course you don't care about that since your (and others') bot armies will have super Q carrots in a world's first month so I'm not even sure why I'm replying to you, lol.

Edit:
On a positive note, however, I must say that you at least brought arguments to the table (unlike the other replies) so thanks for that.

[LadyGoo]

What the normal soil could do is to serve as an accelerator, rather than the quality capper. From what I can tell the current tree quality is just enough to be able to spiral anvils/kilns steadily without extremes. So I do not like the idea of nerfing the soil quality.
The normal soil could be used as an accelerator in the pots as well.

Guano - highest acceleration
Normal soil - medium
Mulch - slow

So mixing guano/soil into pots would let you select quite fast as well. But when you reach the cap, you can switch to mulch.

[Kaios]

But when you reach the cap, you can switch to mulch.

I'm driving towards a destination when all of the sudden I find I've gone around in a circle and have ended back where I was in the first place.

Basically with your idea there still comes a point where regular soil is obsolete which is dumb and the opposite of balanced. Although maybe I'm wrong, why use q300 mulch and top quality water from a raised well when you could have a much faster but lower quality product using spring water and guano!

[Damon_Cooper]

Well, that's what I was talking about some time ago...
Surely, you can't make a soil just from rotten carrots - you can make a fertilizer for making better soil from your own soil.
Though, I doubt it would be changed sometime. Too many people like their new trees.

[DaniAngione]

But when you reach the cap, you can switch to mulch.

I'm driving towards a destination when all of the sudden I find I've gone around in a circle and have ended back where I was in the first place.

Basically with your idea there still comes a point where regular soil is obsolete which is dumb and the opposite of balanced. Although maybe I'm wrong, why use q300 mulch and top quality water from a raised well when you could have a much faster but lower quality product using spring water and guano!

Well, her idea might have this inherent problem because I'm really looking for a way to make soil useful even after Mulch is better - which doesn't take long - but it might also provide with some new idea, I guess.

Perhaps soil can be used as an accelerator regardless of the Mulch being used in the pot. Like, as something else other than the 4 units of mulch/soil you place.

For example, right clicking the small planted tree (size 10) with soil could "accelerate it" a bit and that would be proportional to the soil quality. As if "fertilizing" the tree with natural soil. So both would have their uses and soil wouldn't cap qualities.
Just a thought.

EDIT:

Well, that's what I was talking about some time ago...
Surely, you can't make a soil just from rotten carrots - you can make a fertilizer for making better soil from your own soil.
Though, I doubt it would be changed sometime. Too many people like their new trees.

And yeah. Exactly that

The Composting Bin arrived late in this world, which gave everyone instant access to awesome quality mulch (since pretty much everyone had high quality produce)
And everyone loves some easy and high quality wood, of course.

But if you think about a new world and how the composting bin will make a difference in the early game for the fast farming grinders, you realize that it pretty much kills the regular soil. It becomes useless. And that's sad because regional qualities and such are one of the most interesting features in terms of 'motivating' social interactions, good or bad.