Just revert the hp change for the love of god i beg of you

[Dawidio123]

Let's first get this out of the way, this change might seem beneficial to hermits but it really doesn't change much for them. No matter how much you try to decrease the difference between low and high stats, people who are not interested in that part of the game and have no experience will lose 100% of the time anyways due to how combat works. They aren't losing due to having lower stats or worse gear (well it doesn't help but stats or gear don't affect your ability to run away), they are losing due to skill issue (as elitist as this might sound). Nobody actually cares for hermits when disliking this change.

Now that i appeased all the mouth breathers, i don't believe that this change has been tested in a proper environment like a 5-15 vs 5-15 (vs 5-15 vs 5-15) clusterfuck where everyone is running and someone might just get combo'd by 5 people at the same time for running too far ahead of the rest. So it might be just fine at the start of the world and then turn into everyone getting killed in matter of seconds due to weapon damage scaling higher, maybe it'll be bad to begin with as everyone will be too squishy, or it might be just fine, who knows? Not me, nor the devs.
What about bows, will they make chasing people impossible (ie. 15 people shooting for 10 hp each) or will they be useless? Has this been tested? Will hermits in lql armor/ no armor just get one shooted by a good rbow?
What about grievous damage has it been balanced appropriately so moves that deal higher amount of it aren't just a sure way to kill people?
I can go on and on, but i think i got my point across.

Furthermore pvp as it is right now (between equal parties) is basically 100% about numbers, if you have equal numbers the fight is actually enjoyable (Subjectively, personally I prefer fights up to 5v5 rather than the big 15vs15vs15), if you are outnumbered by like 3-5 people (ie. 4vs7, on equal stats/gear) the only thing you can do is run away and try to combo them if you catch the chasers far apart. This is an issue in itself but it's fair, if someone has more fighters they should have an advantage (obviously). But as it stands right now you can get higher stats and better gear than the other party (easier if you focus your resources on fewer fighters instead of spreading them). Making the difference in stats less impactful (getting 400 con is stupid easy compared to 800 str at which point str starts to slowly give you a small advantage) removes one of the factors that could somehow (not by much) compensate for inferior numbers, so quality vs quantity (quantity wins most of the time).

This change will encourage factions to throw more and more bodies at every fight, and since the entry point of being a fighter will be basically non existent (just get half the stats + uac of top fighter, throw on some shitty gear, and know how to drink), you'll be able to spam out fighting alts that you can lend to people if need be. And i don't think anyone likes big numbers in fights (on either side), it quickly becomes a clusterfuck and it's just unfun to participate in.

[Audiosmurf]

No leave it I wanna see what happens

[Dawidio123]

No leave it I wanna see what happens

Fair point.

[noindyfikator]

They implemented very complicated math under the hood. We should wait for w15 and test it in game. Maybe this time we will stop running around like clowns and actually fight. Surely new solution is well designed and tested.

[yym331]

Well, realistically speaking, casual players may not be all that interested in the game's combat changes, so they neither support nor oppose them. Additionally, the developers have mentioned that they want to create a game that's not solely focused on PvP but rather a game where PvP is also possible. So, the emphasis is on the overall atmosphere and the vision that the developers have.

[HasseKebab]

If armor class also has a fixed stat, which it presumably will have. You'll only get around 100 to 112 AC at best, which puts the power balance of being KO'd by cleaves at 80 to 100 openings which is rather difficult to get to, especially if you're outnumbered since you can just keep kiting and not get hit by 5 Opknocks to full opening. I think this fact makes this game far more balanced on just playing better than what we used to have in older worlds where you just get cleaved at like 30/15 opening and lose 80 hp because the opponent just has a fuckload of str. B12's will still be the kings of the game and the faster you get one out at a good quality, you'll probably roll over people with lower than 100 armor class in the early game, but because quality of the wepaon matters a lot for your attack weight that means it will quickly get outscaled by opponents just raising their con, its a very interesting meta game.


Heres the numbers on cleave at 112 AC, left is hirdsman sword and the right is b12. Looking pretty fair and nothing like we've used to have before.

[SnuggleSnail]

People were very critical of UA equalization when it was announced, including the main big fighty bois and me. Now *everybody* loves it.

There'll prolly be edge cases that make it dog doodoo, or poor scaling with gear, or enforce a yucky low damage chip meta, but if it works out it'll be a game defining positive change.

[loftar]

Let's first get this out of the way, this change might seem beneficial to hermits

Just for the record, the change is very much intended to change the case of actual PvP between higher-leveled people. It's not intended as something to benefit new players.

They implemented very complicated math under the hood.

While I do agree that the math is more complicated than I'd like it to be, I'd also like to stress that it's exactly the same as for the AW/BW comparison, so we're all technically used to it already.

[vatas]

I'd also like to stress that it's exactly the same as for the AW/BW comparison, so we're all technically used to it already.

Sorry if I'm a big dumb, but what the hell is "AW/BW comparison?"

[SnuggleSnail]

Attack Weight/Block Weight