Meaningful hunger

[ekzarh]

I do like all the realism and survival thingies like cold, overheating, hunger, diseases etc. They add atmosphere and fun into game.
But on the other hand - making them too intrusive and boring is a no-no.

So IMO energy could drain over time but smth like 100-200 per hour being online.
Maybe(just maybe) also offline in case character is logged out not in bed or leanto.

This makes you at least take some food with you during long jorneys and either return home or set up a basic camp when you go offline.

Apart from adding atmosphere it also gives some trouble to people like me, who put their chars near 8 cupboards full of curios when they go to work, sleep or do some RL stuff on weekends.

[VDZ]

This makes you at least take some food with you during long jorneys and either return home or set up a basic camp when you go offline.

Also, it kills you if the server crashes and then you have to go to work leaving you unable to play for hours. Not to mention being forced to perform certain actions just to log out is stupid in itself, not everybody always has the time to do that kind of stuff.

[ekzarh]

Also, it kills you if the server crashes and then you have to go to work leaving you unable to play for hours. Not to mention being forced to perform certain actions just to log out is stupid in itself, not everybody always has the time to do that kind of stuff.

First of all - this is the reason why part about offline hunger is optional and subject to additional tweaks in order to prevent death due to cases when player does not log out by himself.

I've seen a lot of games and servers where players had to spend Days, not hours on forced certain actions just to not be banned. These are called RP(roleplaying servers where everyone is obliged to have proper name, background story, playing behavior, speech manner etc etc. And active population there was way bigger than H&H
What I'm trying to say is if you consider some actions stupid does not mean that everyone considers them stupid and nobody considers them attractive. HF home and get to bed takes less than a minute.

[Paradoxs]

But this goes back to 'is it fun" or does it damage the haven experience.

Haven is already an unforgiving landscape where the slightest misclick, or wrong move can earn you nearly permanant damage. Your suggesting that hunger go down offline, and while thats dandy for you and some others, what it does is again, hurt and penalize new players. Hunger is a problem if your being smart about it, you have to balance feps and your hunger bar %. This is a problem for players and balancing satiation can get tricky sometimes. The difficulty in the hunger system is the starvation part, your argument is that it should be easy to starve, or rather that starving should become more common. The problem, and where it kills fun for me, is that unlike most games you dont starve due to hunger, You starve due to energy. What your suggesting is that energy constantly drain whether im chopping a tree or, going for a trade across the map. That im not fond of.

My other two cents and this is why I dont like it. What it does is mean that you are forced to potentially hurt your feps, ruin the balance of your satiations, and get a lower hunger % for larping reasons. Its all dandy to suggest that the game be more open to more playstyles but you cant keep shutting down discussion by saying "Just because you dont like it doesnt mean others don't"

This is a discussion board, we are here to discuss and give pro cons as well as say if we agree or disagree. If people disagree, instead of saying others may enjoy it just because we don't. Take it as part of the poll of people who don't like it, and just because you do, doesnt make it a good idea.

[ven]

That’s not what I’m saying though. Defining “fun” and asking who would like this is something others brought into the discussion, I just responded accordingly. We’re forced to put up with all other major playstyles throughout the entire game, whether we like it or not – pvp, griefing, larp, artistic, and that’s fine. Survival is the only one that gets abandoned once you reach the midgame. Sure, people have their opinion, but when that opinion denies another playstyle a place in the game then discussion is difficult.

But if you keep insisting: what is fun? doing whatever one wants? endlessly grinding without having to worry about micromanagement? For me fun is overcoming challenges. Bears that destroy my armor and give me a wretched gore aren’t fun at all, but successfully killing one is. Having to dig 4 mine levels to find good ore isn’t fun. In fact, it’s borderline insanity. But eventually reaching that ore is rewarding. Hunger is just another challenge.

The issue of hurting the playerbase is relative because, I’ve said it before, there’s a niche for survival elements. You say player count would drop, I say "I can’t know that but it could increase" because these elements, and hunger specifically, are a success in many other games. This indicates, at least, that it’s not so much of an issue as it’s been said and that clearly there is a large number of potential players who would like that. If you’re in the realm of hypotheticals saying “people won’t like it”, I’m in it too saying “people may like it”.


My second argument for more meaningful hunger is that politics, culture and war often developed around food. Wars were economical before they were tactical, and they had more dimensions than the one we have in the game now. I think it would be interesting if food supply and food trains became another variable in conflicts between kingdoms.

I don’t claim to know how exactly hunger should be changed. Offline hunger seems like a really bad idea, but on the other hand I don’t think it’s right either that people leave characters constantly on ravenous status without any downside to it. Hunger doesn’t even need to be deadly, but it feels wrong that being hungry is a positive thing we look forward to ingame.

[VDZ]

We’re forced to put up with all other major playstyles throughout the entire game, whether we like it or not – pvp, griefing, larp, artistic, and that’s fine. Survival is the only one that gets abandoned once you reach the midgame. Sure, people have their opinion, but when that opinion denies another playstyle a place in the game then discussion is difficult.

The elements in play for larpers do not force me to roleplay or else face a penalty. The presence of artists does not cause me to be punished for not having my base look pretty. PvPers can be avoided by being careful enough, and griefing stops being a problem after the early game, far earlier than survival (and it's not really an endorsed play style). Your suggestion, though, would constantly either punish me or force me to waste time to avoid said punishment. I would not oppose a bonus for those doing survival-y things, but I don't want to be punished for not playing in a way I do not find fun.

[Granger]

... I don’t think it’s right either that people leave characters constantly on ravenous status without any downside to it. Hunger doesn’t even need to be deadly, but it feels wrong that being hungry is a positive thing we look forward to ingame.

I think this is an observation that should get further consideration.