A few issues with combat

[blank]

maybe bc you are trying to say uppercut is OP XD dude do you even PvP? why are you complaining now when its been like this for all of w11 (except for the week that jorb introduced the new combat system for like 2 days and took it back)
just bc something doesnt work for you doesnt mean it needs to change.. EVryone on this post has had combacks to your post and i just didnt wanna type out the exact thing everyone else is saying..

mc is mainly a pve/support
UA is mainly pvp

[iamahh]

it got to that point where is too complex to balance out with meaning

the way is simplification, less variables, stronger influence of industry, that is, make weapons and equips be the central point, adding more importance to hunting, farming, item property, market value... stats would be the industry motor that produce the item which would be a simpler point of balancing... complexity can only take you so far, somewhere you have to simplify

[neeco]

2. Parry. I probably don’t need to go in to much detail about parry because I think many players are already aware of how overpowered this maneuver can be. In previous worlds I do not recall unarmed attacks ever being affected by parry and yet now every single punch along with the melee attacks used on a parry player are providing blue opening in return. I don’t think that is how it’s supposed to be.

You lose to it 1v1, yes. But group fights, UA is far too dominant because of the b12 being necessary to cleave through high AC, KITO op, and because of the variety of UA maneuvers available that do more useful things in a group fight than parry. MC needs more maneuvers, not nerfs on its existing ones.

[Kaios]

maybe bc you are trying to say uppercut is OP XD dude do you even PvP? why are you complaining now when its been like this for all of w11 (except for the week that jorb introduced the new combat system for like 2 days and took it back)
just bc something doesnt work for you doesnt mean it needs to change.. EVryone on this post has had combacks to your post and i just didnt wanna type out the exact thing everyone else is saying..

mc is mainly a pve/support
UA is mainly pvp

Yes I’m sure the guys raising up mc as their main attack skill without knowing any better are definitely going to agree that mc is only for support. A punch that can deal damage equal to a sting or cleave over time but with less effort is certainly overpowered and if you’re running that deck solo you are using flex with it and if you’re in a group you can rely on others to do the flexing for you but either way a PUNCH capabale of WEAPON levels of damage with no ip cost is indeed overpowered.

How about responding to my points on parry and telling me whether or not it worked the same way it does now in the past or if I am right and it was different. Or you can just run away like every other asshole does after I refute their posts and they go and hide until I make another post they feel properly equipped to shit on.

it got to that point where is too complex to balance out with meaning

the way is simplification, less variables, stronger influence of industry, that is, make weapons and equips be the central point, adding more importance to hunting, farming, item property, market value... stats would be the industry motor that produce the item which would be a simpler point of balancing... complexity can only take you so far, somewhere you have to simplify

I do not feel what we have right now is complex at all. In fact, there is no reason to even practice all that much considering the meta decks that everyone uses are all effectively utilized in the same manner. This combat sucks giant dick, I don’t feel like I’m improving on anything when I practice, I’m not learning anything new, there’s no skill reliant aspects for me to get better at. It just sucks.

You lose to it 1v1, yes. But group fights, UA is far too dominant because of the b12 being necessary to cleave through high AC, KITO op, and because of the variety of UA maneuvers available that do more useful things in a group fight than parry. MC needs more maneuvers, not nerfs on its existing ones.

I agree with you, but I recall a time when you could choose to raise either stat and could still expect to be viable in combat and not simply relegated to a support role because one lacks more useful moves and maneuvers than the other. I wouldn’t want to see parry only receive a nerf of course, I would love to see improvements and implementations that make melee combat more useful overall.

[blank]

Yes I’m sure the guys raising up mc as their main attack skill without knowing any better are definitely going to agree that mc is only for support. A punch that can deal damage equal to a sting or cleave over time but with less effort is certainly overpowered and if you’re running that deck solo you are using flex with it and if you’re in a group you can rely on others to do the flexing for you but either way a PUNCH capabale of WEAPON levels of damage to with no ip cost is indeed overpowered.

How about responding to my points on parry and telling me whether or not it worked the same way it does now in the past or if I am right and it was different. Or you can just run away like every other asshole does after I refute their posts and they go and hide until I make another post they feel properly equipped to shit on.

over time im assuming you mean with higher opening? all those punch moves have alot to do with your str when applying damage. sting has to do with the Weapon itself+plus str i have never seen a punch do as much as a cleave though. im not sure we are playing the same game at this point XD

i have always thought MC needed a boost or at the very least another maneuver. (mainly bc i mained MC in w10) parry as it is now isnt bad at all. it is however very strong in 1v1 situations but it comes with the price of having to use a sword that does barley any damage other than cutblade but its alot slower than hirdsman. tbh i havent used cutblade enough to give an opinion about it other than its as slow as a b12 with alil less damage.

[Kaios]

No by over time I mean if I don’t let a guy ever get enough opening on me to do a cleave or sting, he can still continuously punch me or use other low cost moves to chip away at my hp simply through the process of trying to get enough opening on me to do a bigger hit. Example, I fight a guy that outstats me but I’m able to keep my openings low enough during the fight that he is unable to effectively kill me. But because the combat system is so shitty, my only recourse against the player that outstats me is to run. The damage on these punches can still get quite high though, even just 20 damage per hit is high when it’s coming from a punch that costs the user nothing themselves.

If I stay and fight I’ll die to punches, if I take the risk of allowing them to get me up to higher opening so I can find an opportunity myself to damage them back I may get a big hit in but have essentially killed myself in the process of doing that. You can put blue opening on a guy immediately and start punching with uppercut and because not only is it giving you opening but also dealing damage the other player ends up forced to do the following things: stop attacking you to lower openings, lower with zig zag, regain composure, or artful, most likely zig zag giving the other person IP so that they can continue to keep damaging you with stronger moves as well and then also forces one in to the precarious position of deciding do I also return the damage with punches and make it a contest of who has the highest con or do you take greater risk in the hopes that they make a mistake or are too tunnel visioned on your higher opening to notice their own.

This is not much different than the flex/kito/cleave meta but at least in the case of kito it has an IP cost and cleave is more difficult to effectively utilize. But it doesn’t really matter anyways because guys with high strength and good B12 can cleave at way lower openings than someone using a sword at equal quality. I actually do like that devs seem to be messing around with armor penetration but how it’s currently set now I believe needs some adjustments. The cooldown increase on B12 is a joke, it has very little effect on most titan characters when comparing them to the average fighter.

[bmjclark]

It seems extremely backwards that UA is the one that does a lot of damage because it can actually use a B12 and MC does no damage because it's forced to either use a hirdsman sword or gimp it's attack speed with a cutblade.

Also, I still stand by this combat system is worse than legacy's in pretty much everyway. I actually dont really understand to this day what was so wrong with legacy's system that warranted going to the new systems in the first place.

[dafels]

Also, I still stand by this combat system is worse than legacy's in pretty much everyway. I actually dont really understand to this day what was so wrong with legacy's system that warranted going to the new systems in the first place.

there were "influental inner circle jerk" people that wanted a braindead combat, because it was "too complex" for 20+ year olds to learn meanwhile i knew 10 year old kids mastering combat back then aka too dum to learn it and they thought they will pvp gods with a dumb combat, instead back in legacy it was 1 defence bar that you had to keep up, but now there is 4 of them and that doesn't contribute to combat at all like the triple quality system we had, now when they got the dumb combat with everyone spamming the same 5 moves and stats > everything instead of a wide set of useful moves and tricks like it was and the design of combat was way better back then which could had been expanded, eat shit fools haha

[Kaios]

You’re not wrong davis but I think some good changes were made back then too, balancing isn’t easy and there were reasonable points made with regard to changing up the combat. I was always against the idea of movement combat because it seemed so cheesy considering how the fighting mechanics worked back then and obviously stuff like a moving player has 0 defense or dropping down construction signs to stop a player from moving, while being a clever use of the mechanics, was not all that ideal either.

I like the combat system we have now because it feels responsive enough that we don’t usually get fucked over so hard by lag spikes or bad ping, but that’s about all I like about it. It’s not interesting and there is nothing in this system that requires a higher level of skill. You don’t even have to time attacks with your cooldown properly because you can just queue the next one up immediately.

[wonder-ass]

Also, I still stand by this combat system is worse than legacy's in pretty much everyway. I actually dont really understand to this day what was so wrong with legacy's system that warranted going to the new systems in the first place.

there were "influental inner circle jerk" people that wanted a braindead combat, because it was "too complex" for 20+ year olds to learn meanwhile i knew 10 year old kids mastering combat back then aka too dum to learn it and they thought they will pvp gods with a dumb combat, instead back in legacy it was 1 defence bar that you had to keep up, but now there is 4 of them and that doesn't contribute to combat at all like the triple quality system we had, now when they got the dumb combat with everyone spamming the same 5 moves and stats > everything instead of a wide set of useful moves and tricks like it was and the design of combat was way better back then which could had been expanded, eat shit fools haha

lmao i was like 12/13 back in legacy xd very true this combat is brain dead i think they could do some fun moves/attacks around cooldowns that could raise the skill level a bit.