On Raiders and The New Mechanic

[loleznub]

Each new Idea this Brony guy comes out with keeps getting even more ridiculous and stupid. Can't wait to see the next one

[Archiplex]

Could we possibly see Hearthing home removed, and eliminate the ability to teleport while carrying an object of any kind?

Anything that allows for teleportation while carrying large objects full of stuff (IE - Boats with two large chests) just increases the ease of raiding.

Or - Alternately... If you have active scents, remove the ability to hearth (while retaining the ability to use roads)

I would like to point out that if you have a major criminal scent, you CANNOT hearth home.

[Lunarius_Haberdash]

I would like to point out that if you have a major criminal scent, you CANNOT hearth home.

This is confirmed now? Awesome, I'd love to see it universally, but this was always the major issue.

On the other hand, it does seem as though this imbalances it the other direction. Why should the raiders be unable to hearth when participating in their normal activities while the foragers/explorers still get to?

[Archiplex]

I would like to point out that if you have a major criminal scent, you CANNOT hearth home.

This is confirmed now? Awesome, I'd love to see it universally, but this was always the major issue.

On the other hand, it does seem as though this imbalances it the other direction. Why should the raiders be unable to hearth when participating in their normal activities while the foragers/explorers are?

Yes, I was trying to find the picture evidence, but when you commit a crime you get a debuff that prevents you from logging out or hearthing home for a certain amount of time. It truly will not impact too much, one person will be considered the "wingman" who will boat home a boat with 6 large chests in it. Ozzy can confirm this and he seems to be suffering from it for a while, it doesn't seem to be expiring in any time fast, and might take 2 weeks for it to expire. Do not forget that wounds are also hard to heal, so raiding will be more spaced out, more organized, and more about completely obliterating your target.

However, raiding is also different. If you kill whoever owns a bond for the claim you raid, and you prevent them successfully from resetting the bond (Done so at claim pikes) for 96 hours, that claim will become yours.

[Granger]

I would like to point out that if you have a major criminal scent, you CANNOT hearth home.

This is confirmed now? Awesome, I'd love to see it universally, but this was always the major issue.

On the other hand, it does seem as though this imbalances it the other direction. Why should the raiders be unable to hearth when participating in their normal activities while the foragers/explorers are?

Because they're scum and don't deserve to?

Makes sense, else one is most likely unable to get the culprit at all.
In case having an active major scent really blocks TP to HF, i'm A-OK with it.

[Lunarius_Haberdash]

Yes, I was trying to find the picture evidence, but when you commit a crime you get a debuff that prevents you from logging out or hearthing home for a certain amount of time. It truly will not impact too much, one person will be considered the "wingman" who will boat home a boat with 6 large chests in it.

However, raiding is also different. If you kill whoever owns a bond for the claim you raid, and you prevent them successfully from resetting the bond (Done so at claim pikes) for 96 hours, that claim will become yours.

That's awesome.. Do we happen to know if the bond of blood and soil requires activity to remain active? If it just has to be in your inventory, there's an alt abuse waiting to happen. This one, thankfully, is able to be overcome by making it only generate Presence when you get XP, unlike the issue with key alts, which is largely impossible to overcome.

As far as the Wingman? Yeah, that's shitty, but one supposes there are certain play issues you can't fix. Wait, yes they can. If there are scents on the map that can show where that object is, you can't hearth with an object of that sort on you.

The next thing they need to do to bring this into balance is make it so that wherever the raider logs off gets a temp hearth fire where they log off that isn't physical, but does interfere with object placement to prevent it from being used as a wall-jumping or similar glitch.

[Lunarius_Haberdash]

It was revealed to me earlier that they did in fact implement the mechanic where you cannot hearth if you have a major scent on the map. There are two things I would see done to make the spirit of this rule come to fruition.

Issue #1 - The Wingman
As I understand the current system, a Wingman could easily hearth home with a boat full of ill-gotten gains while the raiders themselves begin the long walk home. This undermines a significant portion of the point of this rule, to make sure that distance matters. To that end, the wingman issue can be solved handily.

Objects currently locatable by a theft scent can't be hearthed with. If it's in a container you're lifting, in your inventory, or being worn, you can't hearth with it on you.

Issue #2 - The Long Walk Home
Again, as I understand it, a raider who is has recently committed a crime is unable to hearth home, but nor can he be summoned anywhere but AT his hearth fire, meaning he could just quietly log out until the scents fade. To that end, I suggest the following mechanic.

When a raider logs off, an incorporeal hearth fire with a red fire is placed at his location. Scents track to this point, and can be used to summon them at this temporary hearth fire. If you want to be safe, have a place to hide.

This means that tracking a raider across the map is possible, you can intercept him before he's in the safety of his hold, and cannot simply log off to avoid justice. Additionally, his ill-gotten gains cannot be transported home either.

This will encourage raiders to create bolt-holes all over the map, in places they can hide from unwanted invaders. The canny raider will now have to make sure he has a place to hole up until the hate wears off, while still granting him the mobility to be on the map.

Lesser Issue #3
Additionally, the 'stolen' attribute should be inheritable. If an item is crafted from stolen goods, the results are now trackable by the same scent, and cannot be hearthed with until such a time as the scents wear off. Additionally, if you should consume stolen food, even if you had no part in stealing it, you are now unable to hearth until the scent wears off.

Yes, this allows the underhanded to feed stolen food to possible victims unknowingly. As stolen goods can be shared without alerting the receiving party, I don't see this as an issue.

[BangPow]

Lesser Issue #3
Additionally, the 'stolen' attribute should be inheritable. If an item is crafted from stolen goods, the results are now trackable by the same scent, and cannot be hearthed with until such a time as the scents wear off. Additionally, if you should consume stolen food, even if you had no part in stealing it, you are now unable to hearth until the scent wears off.

Yes, this allows the underhanded to feed stolen food to possible victims unknowingly. As stolen goods can be shared without alerting the receiving party, I don't see this as an issue.

I like everything you said except this point. ^^ From what I've read of your previous post's your big on realism, and in the case of realism stolen items are to be sold or used to there advantage like real thieves and raiders do. They wouldn't have theft scent on them.

[Granger]

Yes, I was trying to find the picture evidence, but when you commit a crime you get a debuff that prevents you from logging out or hearthing home for a certain amount of time. It truly will not impact too much, one person will be considered the "wingman" who will boat home a boat with 6 large chests in it.

However, raiding is also different. If you kill whoever owns a bond for the claim you raid, and you prevent them successfully from resetting the bond (Done so at claim pikes) for 96 hours, that claim will become yours.

That's awesome.. Do we happen to know if the bond of blood and soil requires activity to remain active? If it just has to be in your inventory, there's an alt abuse waiting to happen.

As far as i know it has to be in the study to generate presence from the LP you gain from the curios.

This one, thankfully, is able to be overcome by making it only generate Presence when you get XP, unlike the issue with key alts, which is largely impossible to overcome.

Since you need XP to generate LP: this should already be covered.

As far as the Wingman? Yeah, that's shitty, but one supposes there are certain play issues you can't fix. Wait, yes they can. If there are scents on the map that can show where that object is, you can't hearth with an object of that sort on you.

This sounds like a good plan to me: unable to teleport with stolen goods.

The next thing they need to do to bring this into balance is make it so that wherever the raider logs off gets a temp hearth fire where they log off that isn't physical, but does interfere with object placement to prevent it from being used as a wall-jumping or similar glitch.

Also a very good point. The hearth would fix several issues:
- block object placement so you can't logout, have someone drop an object there, log in and exploit 'location unavailale -> spawn at HF'
- enable summon since the character is currently there
- be not as harsh as no logout, since with that the toon would be open to attacks from wildlife

[Lunarius_Haberdash]

- block object placement so you can't logout, have someone drop an object there, log in and exploit 'location unavailale -> spawn at HF'
- enable summon since the character is currently there
- be not as harsh as no logout, since with that the toon would be open to attacks from wildlife

That last is a good point, and there are some options that come with this:

1 - You can build a bolthole, this will enhance your Stealth/Intelligence as a function of the final construction.
2 - Boltholes can be found on accident and destroyed. (Accidental discovery typically occurring by trying to walk over/place an item on an invisible bolt hole)
3 - Boltholes have no more soak than a lean-to.
4 - Destroying a bolthole puts the hearthfire mentioned before on the map.