Nerf Garden Pots

[The_Lich_King]

Trough all the ideas I've read, the one that seems most logical would be to add the Foraged tag to items that were foraged in the wilds, and only allow planting in garden pots of items with such tag.
This way foraging remains relevant trough the entire game. Gardeners could still multiply and raise the quality of the products, but they would still require the base foraged goods. This would re-open a whole market, give greater value to basic foraged goods while still letting the gardeners make their own cut of profits.....

Example: foragers sell [foraged]bluebells for 3 coins, gardeners buys them, grows 6-8 of em and resells em 1 coins each.

Not viable for the end-game quality grind since you can't re-plant your new domesticated bluebells. at that point people would just forage and probably not garden, or gardening would be really underwhelming since you only get one generation of quality up. We have to have a solution where foraging remains relevant (for at least a long enough period of time to actually get any real foraging in) before it gets surplanted by gardening and gardening shouldn't immediately replace it. It needs to be gradual.

If i have learned anything from coming back to w11, is it's that if it nerfs the end-game grinding loop in any way, or in anyway tries to alter the game so that the grinding isn't too bad in the end, people tell you that the grinding is the game and you can't nerf anything that would interfere with the monotany.

[ludibrium]

Wts q500 bluebell, 100 tokens. Been raising it since day 1 of the server and am finally ready to part ways with it. Lol

This made me LOL. On the pots topic, are we going to be able to pot the coltsfoot like other foragables of it's kind? Thanks.

[Lyrroth]

Not viable for the end-game quality grind since you can't re-plant your new domesticated bluebells. at that point people would just forage and probably not garden, or gardening would be really underwhelming since you only get one generation of quality up. We have to have a solution where foraging remains relevant (for at least a long enough period of time to actually get any real foraging in) before it gets surplanted by gardening and gardening shouldn't immediately replace it. It needs to be gradual.

If i have learned anything from coming back to w11, is it's that if it nerfs the end-game grinding loop in any way, or in anyway tries to alter the game so that the grinding isn't too bad in the end, people tell you that the grinding is the game and you can't nerf anything that would interfere with the monotany.

people wouldnt bother with gardening if only for one generation that will be equal to forage in terms of quality for half year maybe up to year world old. fully gardner takes on average month to complete where enough resource to start pushing quality significal up starts after another month or few. it doesnt happen immediatly it happens overtime.

its not about only grinding but being optimal. i dont wanna to keep eating blueberry pies until end of the world in quantites for 1000 to level up. heck i dont even want to eat blueberry pies from start to end. but atleast it is my choice if i eat them later on or not due to quality boost from gardening LATE into game world on my crafter.

[Groniak]

Trough all the ideas I've read, the one that seems most logical would be to add the Foraged tag to items that were foraged in the wilds, and only allow planting in garden pots of items with such tag.
This way foraging remains relevant trough the entire game. Gardeners could still multiply and raise the quality of the products, but they would still require the base foraged goods. This would re-open a whole market, give greater value to basic foraged goods while still letting the gardeners make their own cut of profits.....

Example: foragers sell [foraged]bluebells for 3 coins, gardeners buys them, grows 6-8 of em and resells em 1 coins each.

Not viable for the end-game quality grind since you can't re-plant your new domesticated bluebells. at that point people would just forage and probably not garden, or gardening would be really underwhelming since you only get one generation of quality up. We have to have a solution where foraging remains relevant (for at least a long enough period of time to actually get any real foraging in) before it gets surplanted by gardening and gardening shouldn't immediately replace it. It needs to be gradual.

If i have learned anything from coming back to w11, is it's that if it nerfs the end-game grinding loop in any way, or in anyway tries to alter the game so that the grinding isn't too bad in the end, people tell you that the grinding is the game and you can't nerf anything that would interfere with the monotany.

Don't forget that higher Q pots, water and mulch will raise the product Q, so even in the 'end-game' if you take a q 10 foraged bluebell and toss in in your best pots with best water and mulch, you CAN get those bluebells way up in Q. The idea here would be to prevent foraging from becoming useless on day 3, especially considering there is a credo dedicated to foraging... No activity should ever become totally irrelevant. Can you imagine if miners could multiply their ore? If fisherman could raise fish in ponds inside their walls? What if i could kill one whale, then harvest it every 5 days and flesh just grew back?

We already had Farming, tree growing and herding which could be done entirely without leaving one's walls. When Gardening was added, the mistake made was that it took away a part of the game and turned it into something else, instead of adding new content that would go hand in hand with the old stuff. If gardening would have been linked to foraging, and needing [foraged] items to be planted from the very start, everyone would have been happy.

See, the deal should have been: Wow i can now plant my foraged items to multiply them AND raise the Q?!?! awesome!
Instead now that we discuss nerfing pots we got: Whoa! Your saying i wont be able to endlessly raise Q, and IL have to actually INTERACT with players if i want to get foraged stuff without leaving my walls? *senseless yelling and complaining*

[Lyrroth]

See, the deal should have been: Wow i can now plant my foraged items to multiply them AND raise the Q?!?! awesome!
Instead now that we discuss nerfing pots we got: Whoa! Your saying i wont be able to endlessly raise Q, and IL have to actually INTERACT with players if i want to get foraged stuff without leaving my walls? *senseless yelling and complaining*

flawless logic but fails at point where a lot of people are against nerfing garden but more into expanding both. the thing is that foraging as profession doesnt take a loot to work on. you increase survival to 100 or even as low as 50 and double it with gildings then you only increase exploration so one stat in total. pair it with eating mostly perc food and you very quickly and without much of effort gain an ability to trade where you want to get somewhat rich/serious in making money. that is just wrong.

now compare that to gardening. you need to complete forager which clearly shows us that gardner is expansion of forager not one killing another. its like evolving pikachu with thunderstone but for some weird reason a lot of you are like ash pikachu - refuse to evolve in disguise of safe walls. then you need to do a farmer to do a gardner to become a gardner. on top of that you need to be a farmer that rises quality of carrot or turnip to have a mulch of decent quality, lets say it takes a month. to have a good quality mulch you need to have good quality board and blocks with means tree planting next to decent saw q which means either being excellent miner or proficient hunter to gain bones which bones are also needed in making quality pots and keep increasing it quality so automatically you are either forced to LEAVE AND TRADE or LEAVE AND HUNT. for some reason all of you speak about "easy clay nodes" and stuff while i clearly remember fighting for A GOOD QUALITY CLAY SPOT where you maybe had half decent one and therefore had easy time. constant fuel burn and constant clay making to keep that q rising that becomes relevant after 2 MONTHS into the game.

you all want to destroy instead of expanding and are blind to counter arguments. you say we cry but i say you are screaming. there is no point. there is no discussion. you do not try to understand. you all about theory and safety being completely blind to experiences somebody else actually had.

not to say you all the time to forgot pearls cammomile and such stuff that still is somehow finding its way into trade.

[Granger]

you all want to destroy instead of expanding and are blind to counter arguments. you say we cry but i say you are screaming. there is no point. there is no discussion. you do not try to understand. you all about theory and safety being completely blind to experiences somebody else actually had.

I guess this can be said about most on both sides of this, and quite some other, 'discussions' on this forum.

[MagicManICT]

i'm going to say these discussions are all about hypothesizing because we have no way of testing concepts other than through math and what we* understand of the player population.

*"We" being the whole group of individual players as there is no pronoun in the English language to fit here. Any one individual is going to have a different take on what the rest of the game wants that is heavily influenced by their own biases. "Everyone" needs to chill out a bit when these sorts of discussions come up as nobody's view is perfect.

[MadNomad]

i mean people used to go out and hunt too but why bother at this point when there's good cheese and domestic animals and etc? or is your solution to nerf those as well?

yes

[Archiplex]

I don't understand how y'all figure the way to move forward is by making content worse instead of introducing new content that fulfills what people want.

This is barely about gardening or domestic animals, it's about people being inside walls.

[Vigilance]

I don't understand how y'all figure the way to move forward is by making content worse instead of introducing new content that fulfills what people want.

This is barely about gardening or domestic animals, it's about people being inside walls.

totally and entirely correct, this has ALWAYS been the problem.