wound from smith

[MagicManICT]

I don't see anyone posting better ways to fix metals.

Max natural quality 1/2 to 1/4 of current highest natural quality... it would change the current levels of the industry qualities at the given point of the world.

[MagicManICT]

Mod note: merged identical threads.

[ctopolon4]

if u like metal Q spiral lets push that to everything
get 7 metal bar => anvil+hammer => crit => 7bar Q raise => repeat
get 7 block of wood => ?someth? => crit => 7block Q raise
get 7 clay => ?somesth => crit => Q raise
no timers, no wounds, no limits, no other resources involved

[Granger]

if u like metal Q spiral lets push that to everything

Please no.

The critical hit mechanic is bad as it leads to overinflated qualities.

The only path I see for the mechanic to stay is to introduce items/objects in the game degrading by use, significantly enough resulting in spiral and decay going toward a steady state that can't be overcome permanently.

Tool degradation would also further trade as the hq tool one obtained from a market wouldn't be the last one a non-spiraling hearthling would ever need.

[TestLol]

What the point in the degrading mechanics (In any aspect)?
People play to make quality better, to make stats higher. If quality and stats will be degrading - i will just stop to play - it doesn't give any pleasure - to see that your quality or stats are degrading and you need to do something to stop them - it only gives feeling of stress, lol.
What the point in stat caps and any limiting of quality/stats growth?
I was searching for game without stat caps and limits to what you can gain, and that is why i'm playing H&H.
There are plenty of games with stat caps and quality caps -why you don't play them?
(The same thing with complaining about permadeath/free pvp - it is distinctive things for H&H, thanks to which many players choosed to play it. If you don't like it - why did you ever choose this game, when there are many games without it?)
Idk, from which i see in forums -it looks like there are group of people who can't play good, so demand to restrict other players from playing good and achieving good results.
It is game, not real life, where logic of restricting strong one for the weak one still can work in some aspects!
Games are created for concurrention, for letting strong ones to win, and weak ones try hard to get good - and all this without actual hurt in real life. And you get plenty of way to win, but you prefer to demand to destroy game at all, by equalizing those who plays better and those who plays worse. Nobody will play in such game, except you. There will be just nothing to do there. All those "roleplaying, pixel art, etc" - it is for week, for two - but it will be deadly boring for more than 2 weeks.
You need to try to play better instead of demanding of restricting those who plays good.
(And no, i'm not that good myself and also get butthurted by strong players sometime. But i know what to do - it is game, and i need to get good - not change rules, so good players will not get preferences, because they are good.)

[shubla]

I don't see anyone posting better ways to fix metals.

Max natural quality 1/2 to 1/4 of current highest natural quality... it would change the current levels of the industry qualities at the given point of the world.

How would that fix anything?

Just delaying the inevitable?
Actually that would make the problem worse, because of the quality formula. 10 -> 40 is better increase than 300 -> 360

So the lower the natural quality, the more benefit would one get from spinning the metals.

[Granger]

What the point in the degrading mechanics (In any aspect)?
What the point in stat caps and any limiting of quality/stats growth?

Simple answer: removing 95+% of the arguments fueling this topic.

In case you're interested to know (instead of pure speculating about, as you did in most of the rest of your first post) my reasoning behind this stance, feel free to read my relevant comments in C&I.

[MagicManICT]

How would that fix anything?

It actually wouldn't? Wow... I must have left my sarcasm hat back at home.

It would slow progression greatly. It's not a complete fix, no, but one of a few things that could be done to slow the power game down. I gather that is what the goal of the general idea here is, right?

[TestLol]

Simple answer: removing 95+% of the arguments fueling this topic.

I read first 5 pages and 2 last and honestly, i don't see that 95% of the arguments there would be about need for wipe because of high quality and stats of top players.
There are different arguments, some people tell that they need more hardcore, some people tell that they need less, and most people tell that they are ok right now. There are some people, who are complaining about high stats(and looks like you are one of them) - but it is definitely not 95%, and there are not less people who are opposing those though.
There are about 33 pages more, so maybe of course there are your 95%, but my sample didn't showed that you was right.
Argument, that i read there about high stats/quality - was that new player can't compete with old, if there are no stat caps and slowing down. I think it is not true, basically i know people who make chars with thousands of stats in some weeks(but of course you need a base for it - but because of all things of top q, which are selling at market - it isn't that hard to build. Well it is hard, if you talk about work you put there - but old player also did it at some stage(and when they didn't have good tools, etc), so it is only just).
Basically, building a base for making characters with good stats, much easier now, than it was in the early world - when old players did this. And having such base, you can make good characters pretty fast. The more so, the higher stats - the harder to gain new stats, so if you are really ready to invest that amount of work, which old players invested, you will catch up with them pretty fast.

[LostJustice]

What the point in the degrading mechanics (In any aspect)?
What the point in stat caps and any limiting of quality/stats growth?

Simple answer: removing 95+% of the arguments fueling this topic.

In case you're interested to know (instead of pure speculating about, as you did in most of the rest of your first post) my reasoning behind this stance, feel free to read my relevant comments in C&I.

No, it would just lead me to save best saw for upgrades only till I can make a better saw and use second hand saws for everything else till they break. Plus once that anvil is made, I can make a bunch more saws. It doesn't fix the problem. What magic wrote about halving the spiral and doubling the natural rate tbh would be on right track to maybe a fix but then again, like shubla said it would eventually just be spiraled as well. If you want the honest answer, I think the biggest issue here is that players do not know how to catch up and much rather complain. Like noted above this, yes it possible to catch up stat wise. If you want to catch up quality wise, well it possible and just takes a lot of dedication and work. I think the issue is not the main mechanic of spiraling but the fact of infinite quality. In no matter which way this gets fixed, a longer playing group will generally have the higher quality especially if it contains veteran players like any faction. And just anyway you look at it, a more dedicated group who wants top q will generally always be near it. Others that join late or fail in some way will need to catch up on the countless hours that has already been spent obtaining current quality. Even then there are ways around this to save time. And it should to be noted that the current quality didn't just happen over night or within a short period. No it has been going since world start and if I joined this game at this stage, it really shouldn't be expected for me to reach that quality since I haven't been here since world start (But in this case I have been here since world start). But as noted, even I and others get tired of spiraling. We can only do it for so long. Eventually we will fall off once we are tired or quit the game and that means others can catch up. So really I think the issue is the lack of will power here more than anything and there is not much here to fix.