Suggestion: disable or limit stealing from KO'ed characters

[Hasta]

-1
losing in pvp is already lenient enough

Why do you feel the need for PvP loss to be as punishing as possible? Please, explain the reasoning here.

If there is no loss there is no game.
If everyone wins you are just playing a simulation.

Please stop reducing my argument to absurdity, you're strawmanning, it reflects on you poorly.

Noone is taking away the ability to inflict a loss.
The suggestion is to get close to a balance between loss and effort.
The attacker's effort is rewarded with the satisfaction of the attacked player being annoyed and bothered. Losing the gear is unnecessary in this equation. The "pro" side even granted to the "counter" side the inventory items and, argueably, curios slot.

[Hesufo]

Agree, I'd suggest allow the stealing of inventory + maybe one to two pieces of equipment and curio each, selected randomly from the character upon KO. Full loot if they have used rage to initiate combat or commited serious crimes within the past 7 days.

PVP advocates really have no argument, as shown in the previous 4 pages. PVP in Haven & Hearth exists as a way to facilitate dispute resolution, prevent griefing, and exert power, as per the developers' own manifesto. You can do all that without fucking over a peaceful character's progress.

I'd like to quote a relevant phrase by the own devs on PVP from that thread:

New players, I would also like to add, should be, and are, particularly easy to target. The amount of investment needed to create one is so small that affording them any means of special security is inviting for them to be used as grief-machines and if they die, not much has been lost.

By this same logic, someone's hard earned equipment and study report a couple of days -or weeks- down the line, is a significant investment in relative terms. It may be the only equipment set they own. They might be waiting for thousands of LP's worth of curios. They might not have the means to heal all their wounds quickly. They will spend hours remaking their sets and healing, and lose many hours or even days of LP progress, whereas the ganker in most cases didn't take over 5 minutes to get them knocked out and stripped down. Thus, they should be deserving of some protection. Full loot on KO only serves to punish them further with no real ulterior purpose.

However, the idea is to protect the non PVP oriented characters, hermits and overall nubs. This is why I would limit this loot protection to characters that haven't initiated combat through Rage or commited serious crimes during the last 7 days.

[caz]

So post above - if there is going to be a pvp event such as meteorite, and one of the teams realises they're losing... What is to stop them trading everything to a fresh alt they bring along so it can't be stolen from?

Edit: not even a fresh alt, just bring a character with super high con that hasn't committed any crimes so it can tank any attempts at killing it

[Hesufo]

I mean if they have the time to trade their shit away to an alt character on location before that alt can be KO'd, they might as well just run away.
Still, I'm assuming the team that resorts to what you suggest is losing and so is risking impending KO's and wants to mitigate item losses. They would be trading away their equipment - thus risking death from lack of armour - and forfeiting their study progress report. A huge risk, and not the greatest of ideas if you ask me.

[Halbertz]

I will never understand why in the world where you can be everyone most people decide to be prey. And also complain about it.

[TheServant]

this will never be implemented.. i dont understand how you guys cant see that and waste your time with many words

[Hesufo]

this will never be implemented.. i dont understand how you guys cant see that and waste your time with many words

I will never understand why in the world where you can be everyone most people decide to be prey. And also complain about it.

Non-arguments again. There's always a place for game balance and investment-return considerations on PVP. Why do you think crimes are expensive skills and not on for everyone by default? And rage/vandalism just got even more expensive this world.

[hero202]

Not gonna lie, this thread looks like talking with a wall, being killed in this game rn is literally not possible, therefore you are actually removing the whole loot mechanic from the game which pretty much disables pvp in the game since there would not be any gain in it. Also if you think that raiding a base is actually a possibility go try yourself and then we can even start talking, so pls stop spouting nonsense, just advocate to that pve server which will never happen

-1

[azrid]

Why do you feel the need for PvP loss to be as punishing as possible? Please, explain the reasoning here.

If there is no loss there is no game.
If everyone wins you are just playing a simulation.

Please stop reducing my argument to absurdity, you're strawmanning, it reflects on you poorly.

Noone is taking away the ability to inflict a loss.
The suggestion is to get close to a balance between loss and effort.
The attacker's effort is rewarded with the satisfaction of the attacked player being annoyed and bothered. Losing the gear is unnecessary in this equation. The "pro" side even granted to the "counter" side the inventory items and, argueably, curios slot.

Sir please! You are misrepresenting my opinion in the first place.
I don't wish pvp loss to be as harsh as possible.

Item loss is not that harsh of a penalty.
You create your own risk by wearing +16 int gilding outside.
You are the one who has the freedom to mitigate that risk by wearing something less provocative.
Use your free will to make your next loss in pvp not as hard. Don't wear that cool item outside if you are not willing to risk losing it.

[Avu]

All the pvp-er arguments are:
-you victims fail because you don't play exactly in the narrow way we play, this game was made for us play like us or leave
-being scum is oh so hard work think of the scums feelings, if we don't destroy everyone else's fun how can we exist in this world? woe is us
-bring up some narrow case situation where it needs to be how it is conveniently ignoring all the easy ways that niche case could be solved
-stop complaining cause nothing will change

And for jorb and loftar: If you ever wanted this game to be any kind of simulation of human nature and developing of societies and you're not completely detached from reality you probably realize it has failed at that. Civilizations are not forming, hierarchies, laws justice just don't exist. It's just law of the jungle tribe level shit at best but not even that because not even tribals would be stupid enough to fight just to fight when death was a possibility. If your goal was cheap drama instigated by stunted individuals well I'm sure that part you got plenty. Still a pity you put so much effort into a simulation just to see dumb kids kicking others sandcastles.