99% of PVP/permadeath woes are an onboarding issue

[popatria]

Your argument is - "you can get good in pvp if you try hard enough"
My argument is - I don't want it. I like the other aspects of the game. I know a handfull of people who quit because they didn't like being unwillingly forced into this content.
I can understand 5 people really liking it, I'm just not one of them, and voicing my opinion.

git gud

[vatas]

Your argument is - "you can get good in pvp if you try hard enough"
My argument is - I don't want it. I like the other aspects of the game. I know a handfull of people who quit because they didn't like being unwillingly forced into this content.
I can understand 5 people really liking it, I'm just not one of them, and voicing my opinion.

git gud

So you agree Valhalla should be improved to serve as a training ground (or some other form of "practice mode" should be implemented?)

[Austinh15]

I did not rape anyone otherwise i would be in jail.

I feel like you could go on a variety of college campus frat houses and get the same comment. Curious.

Anyways, I liked it a lot better when you weren't here, because then I didn't have to be here to argue with you. Can we go back to that? I'll leave if you leave, pinky promise.

[benisalt1]

pvp is inherently a high cortisol event for majority of players, no amount of band-aids will fix that

"Maybe we should organize events where we teach people how to swim."

"ANY TIME YOU GO INTO THE WATER, THERE'S A SMALL CHANCE THAT YOU WILL DROWN!"

"Welp... that's technically true, but I don't think that it really adds anything to the conversation."

WELL okay I actually think that if combat system was not so EGGHEADED, it may be the only way to save it. I play since 2011 and i never liked it, it always felt like the only way to solve it without being a snail-level EGGHEAD NERD yourself to use scripts that automate decisions (which i am currently experimenting with in my custom client).
Remove openers in favor of flat attack power vs armor value, give all moves to everyone on spawn. Add cc, debuffs, buffs and healing. Make it focused on cc and buffs, like a proper game.

[ZamAlex]

Add cc, debuffs, buffs and healing. Make it focused on cc and buffs, like a proper game.

Add magic, dragons, anime girls with big boobas, gacha and jorb must return to draw porn again. Everything for "proper game".

I play since 2011

Yeah mate, pressing 3 buttons; Zig-Zag, Sidestep and Quick Dodge is strait impossible task without scripts. You need to play another 50 years to make it, real.

[SnuggleSnail]

The combat system is EXTREMELY easy. I've friends from other games who played have for maybe 3-5 hours who are better than most of the fighters from the main PVP groups.

The reason 99% of the playerbase sucks ass is because the developers are prodigies of being incompetent. There is no way to 'naturally' learn any aspect of PVP. Doesn't matter how long you've played, somebody has to coach you or you will never gain a basic understanding of PVP concepts.

No normal person is wants to be coached, let alone go out of their way to find a coah. Normal people just want to play the game and slowly get better from natural experience. You can't do that in haven. Not because the combat system is uniquely complicated or something, jorbtar is just bad at game design

[Halbertz]

because PVP style combat is completely disconnected from regular play.

Next patch:

-Animals now always use defences when they are >20% openings
-Animals now have stances
-In single combat, animals will not engage you. Instead, they will flee, pick up speed buffs, and use a teleport skill once they got distance or wait for reinforcements.
-Pack animals now have opK
-Pack animals will attempt to surround you more aggressively
-Animals can now swim
-Animals can now use vehicles. Vehicles vary depending on the animal type: bears use unicycles, etc.

[SnuggleSnail]

Ye, I think because of their swedishness if they took my insults to heart it'd probably make the game more annoying without actually teaching anything.

IMO one concept you can practice per animal, even basic shit like:

• Animals affected by terrain maluses
• Animals use 1:1 the same stances and moves as players unless there's a specific purpose not to
• Animals speed always roughly equal to hearthling speed unless there's a specific purpose not to
• Ant queen combat med tutorial with baby ants fueling her
• Wild cows OPK tutorial where they don't do damaging moves at all until you're like 90 blue
• Some animals run in circles (not actual circles, but what a PVPer would call a circle) so people can catch up and see it's retarded to do that
• Lynx tries to do a long CD attack then clip you on nearby terrain/chase nearby critters
• Wolves just try to surround you and do basically no damage until they do to simulate running from multiple people
• Rabbit runs over speedbuffs
• Some animals should use raw hide (mammoth doesn't count the condition is never met and people killing mammoths don't need to learn what rawhide is)
• There would also need to actually be some reason for kill these animals...
• Could probably brainstorm a million more in like an hour

idk I think it's pretty obvious there's never even been an attempt to teach the player anything

[ZamAlex]

The combat system is EXTREMELY easy. I've friends from other games who played have for maybe 3-5 hours who are better than most of the fighters from the main PVP groups.

The reason 99% of the playerbase sucks ass is because the developers are prodigies of being incompetent. There is no way to 'naturally' learn any aspect of PVP. Doesn't matter how long you've played, somebody has to coach you or you will never gain a basic understanding of PVP concepts.

No normal person is wants to be coached, let alone go out of their way to find a coah. Normal people just want to play the game and slowly get better from natural experience. You can't do that in haven. Not because the combat system is uniquely complicated or something, jorbtar is just bad at game design

It's actually very true, you need couch to understand basics and motivation to watch couple videos at youtube. Or you will just waiting until random encounter with traveling swordsman who will be your couch (strangers at this game do even this for no reason sometimes).

About normal person - playing this game as new player you quite fast start understanding that you have colossal gap at game knowledge and wiki will not help you with it. So you just start talking with other people and asking them to share information. It's become natural process at some point and most people, especially if you manage to be at same group, will share with you everything they know. It's including combat knowledge, of course.

[SnuggleSnail]

It's become natural process at some point and most people, especially if you manage to be at same group, will share with you everything they know. It's including combat knowledge, of course.

I don't think this is true for combat. An average village doesn't have a single person good enough at combat to teach. And even if it does a normal person doesn't want to spend 10 hours sparring them for the 1% chance I attack them. And even if they do 1v1 practice isn't real.

I'm happy to admit I'm biased and possibly wrong, but I think I'm right. Can we get a hermit opinion? You guys EVER do serious running practice trying to catch/escape each other? I've offered to do this for hermits lots of time FOR FREE and they basically never accept