Aggro range or hearth timer needs to be increased

Thoughts on the further development of Haven & Hearth? Feel free to opine!

Re: Aggro range or hearth timer needs to be increased

Postby rye130 » Sun Sep 27, 2015 7:24 pm

Sever wrote:To actually solve the problem this way means trying to split a scalpel with a sword. How are you supposed to balance one perfect script versus another? If you pick too long a hearth timer or too large an aggro range, then the player always dies in script versus script, or player vs script. Go the other way and they always survive. A completely different kind of solution is required to even partially address it.

Is there anything wrong with allowing hearthing under aggro with a longer timer? If instead of a few seconds, it took ten seconds while aggroed, the attacker would have a chance, and an obligation if they want to keep them there, to make their move to cancel hearthing. And since it would take so long to do, it would be anywhere from a gamble to a strategy whether you could get away in time. If it was clear they could get to you quickly, you better run. If you did outrun them, or got somewhere safe, you could immediately start hearthing instead of waiting for an arbitrary cooldown. I'm sure there's something I'm not considering, but to me it seems like that would kill auto-hearthing as it would only work situationally, like if there are a lot of ridges or a wall/water/swamp, and it would cause you to deal with the aggressor, but allow you to escape for good if you already managed to get out of range.


This is a decent idea, the balance of being able to get to the player and land a hearth-breaking move before the teleport out would need to be found. When not obstructed by cliffs/water/swamp, it should be pretty likely that the hearthing won't work, while being able to port out should be pretty likely if there are those obstructions.
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Re: Aggro range or hearth timer needs to be increased

Postby LaserSaysPew » Sun Sep 27, 2015 7:30 pm

Remove autohearthing by adding a simple captha. Implement a wound on aggro and murder:
1. Every time you aggro someone, you get a wound for 5 dmg(Regret) that can only be healed by something one at a time with a moderate debuff while healing.
2. Every time you murder someone you get 10 wounds for 5 dmg each(Mental Anguish) with a debuff to int until healed. Healed also one at a time with a slightly more rare foragable or craftable item.
That way you can attack people and you can rob them at a small price. Murdering is also an option but at a huge price that mostly prevents you from going on a murdering spree. (you still can do it with enough cons and if you don't care that you won't study any curio for a long time after that)

Maybe even more debuffs on murder wounds like str, agi. One village can go and raid the other. Murdering everyone will result in(let's say there are equal number of people on both sides) everyone getting wounds for murder and thus the victorious village will be weakened for some time(2 days or smth) until they heal. Which is normal since fighting and war weaken people. On the other hand, just robbing other village will result in far less debuffs and wounds and will leave the villagers alive, which, I presume, will be a better situation for them. That can start a longterm wars, treaties and people will actually live to fight once again.
Last edited by LaserSaysPew on Sun Sep 27, 2015 7:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Aggro range or hearth timer needs to be increased

Postby Shrapnelx » Sun Sep 27, 2015 7:40 pm

Looool, cry more.

You have auto-aggro, and you also have auto-hearth.. seems fair to me.

If you ask for it to be changed to where you can always catch them, then the game is now balanced in PvPers favor, pissing off the 'carebears.'

One way or another, not everyone will be happy with any change to aggro range or health timer. Just be happy that you don't need a 200k skill to murder someone and Rams are easy to build.
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Re: Aggro range or hearth timer needs to be increased

Postby bmjclark » Sun Sep 27, 2015 7:59 pm

Shrapnelx wrote:You have auto-aggro, and you also have auto-hearth.. seems fair to me.


1) Don't have auto aggro
2) Auto hearth beats auto aggro anyways
3) I'd pay 200k for murder if it meant that i could actually catch people before they auto hearth
Cajoes wrote:I was the murder victim your guy aggro'd. And slew. Entirely unprovoked. Rather handily at that. Which prompted the retaliatory party. That you also handily slew.
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Re: Aggro range or hearth timer needs to be increased

Postby Shrapnelx » Sun Sep 27, 2015 8:04 pm

bmjclark wrote:
Shrapnelx wrote:You have auto-aggro, and you also have auto-hearth.. seems fair to me.


1) Don't have auto aggro
2) Auto hearth beats auto aggro anyways
3) I'd pay 200k for murder if it meant that i could actually catch people before they auto hearth


You missed the point.. If you make it so you can always catch people, your going to make the PvPers happy, and piss off the Carebears.. basically flipping over the issue, rather than solving it.
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Re: Aggro range or hearth timer needs to be increased

Postby Tamalak » Sun Oct 25, 2015 9:41 pm

1. Instant teleportation away from conflict is a stupid mechanic, period. Made even stupider by auto-teleport.
2. If this mechanic were removed without other changes to the game it would be a slaughter (100% escape would be replaced by 100% ganking - not an improvement).
3. Therefore, engagement and escape in the field has to be redesigned.

If you're in the field and attacked, it should be possible to escape even a superior opponent depending on (just brainstorming):
-A skill (stealth?)
-A stat (agility? Perception? Charisma??)
-Preparation (things like a waterskin)
-NOT how early you start to escape vs. how early he engages, since that's just a matter of what autowin client you're using.

Whatever the "pursuit" stat/skill is vs. the "escape" stat/skill, the escape should have an advantage. Maybe you should expect to successfully flee if you have half the pursuer's total score? The square root of it?

I also think that murdering someone should incur HHP damage ("Guilt" injury??). This would keep people from just going on a random PK slaughter while keeping it very much viable to kill people who annoy you.

I don't know how the escape would work. Maybe like a super-speed escape mode that you can trigger that does hard HP damage to you so you don't use it for travel? This seems like a very difficult design problem.
Last edited by Tamalak on Sun Oct 25, 2015 11:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Aggro range or hearth timer needs to be increased

Postby spawningmink » Sun Oct 25, 2015 10:31 pm

bump bump bump
please fix
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Re: Aggro range or hearth timer needs to be increased

Postby venatorvenator » Sun Oct 25, 2015 11:09 pm

please fix
There's nothing to be fixed, stop trying to turn this game into a noob slaughterhouse, autoaggro is already enough.
You fight people who also want to fight with you, or you use horses, or you come up with a better ambush strategy, or you just raid them properly instead of wandering out on the map looking for easy sprucecap kills.
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Re: Aggro range or hearth timer needs to be increased

Postby spawningmink » Sun Oct 25, 2015 11:32 pm

venatorvenator wrote:
please fix
There's nothing to be fixed, stop trying to turn this game into a noob slaughterhouse, autoaggro is already enough.
You fight people who also want to fight with you, or you use horses, or you come up with a better ambush strategy, or you just raid them properly instead of wandering out on the map looking for easy sprucecap kills.

you cant get to someone before they port away, its not possible on foot shut up and go back to farming
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Re: Aggro range or hearth timer needs to be increased

Postby Potjeh » Sun Oct 25, 2015 11:45 pm

So use a horse.
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