Change Visitor Debuff

[Drakoth]

It makes no sense to me that I'm unable to steal from someone if they accidentally leave their front door wide open, or that I could kill someone and take the key to their base off their corpse, open the gate to their base, and stand right in front of all that precious loot without being able to touch it unless I bash through a wall with a wrecking ball. I understand the implementation of the visitor debuff to make people feel more comfortable with social interaction and to make it easier to trade, but it doesn't make sense to force it on an unwanted guest with clearly bad intentions. Nobody should feel safe leaving their base open for anyone to enter. That makes no sense in a game like Haven and Hearth, and I always considered it a crucial part of the game. Locking doors has become practically pointless. I have a simple solution that makes sense to me.

If someone has criminal acts enabled before they enter the gate, they shouldn't get the visitor debuff, and it should be considered tresspassing. The person clearly doesn't intend to have a friendly visit if they have criminal acts enabled. And, if someone enters through the gate without criminal acts enabled, they shouldn't be able to enable it with the visitor debuff on, just so they aren't able to change their mind.

I see no reason why this wouldn't be implemented. There is no reason to protect someone stupid enough to leave their gate open, or to let their key fall into someone else's hands. At the very least, I think the visitor debuff should be thought about more.

[Ysh]

If someone has criminal acts enabled before they enter the gate, they shouldn't get the visitor debuff, and it should be considered tresspassing.

This function is entire function of visitor debuff. I can agree for if you have master key to gate then you do not get debuff though.

[shadyg0d]

I always thought protecting/stealing keys was an interesting PvP mechanic and I'm not a huge fan of visitor.

When you start to think about keys and open gates as a competitive mechanic it gets pretty silly though. In real life you wouldn't have a key for a palisade(I don't think?), and you would not be able to just walk into a huge village and steal without considerable stealth abilities. They'd see you coming and close the gates, or just kill you. You'd have to lay siege to the place first. These empty villages with their gate open are not actually empty, there's just nobody to play the part of guard 24/7, hence the shield. If you look at it like a simulation, there would be security and guards in a real village even if the actual players are sleeping(They wouldn't account for the entire population). At least that's how I think about it

Anyway keys are not completely useless. Global resources cannot have visitor buff and require key. It's also useful for controlling access to different areas in a village.

If someone has criminal acts enabled before they enter the gate, they shouldn't get the visitor debuff, and it should be considered tresspassing. The person clearly doesn't intend to have a friendly visit if they have criminal acts enabled. And, if someone enters through the gate without criminal acts enabled, they shouldn't be able to enable it with the visitor debuff on, just so they aren't able to change their mind.

That is actually a great idea but needs more thinking on, as it destroys the idea of leaving your gate open for trade. If this was possible people would just close all their gates and it wouldn't really matter. I still like the idea and can think of some situations where it would be cool to have.

[LadyGoo]

I always thought protecting/stealing keys was an interesting PvP mechanic

Could you remind me please when this has ever been a thing?
Legacy? No-one would come outside with the keys, because everyone used the crossroads. Or key alts, same thing. It has never been something likely to happen, if you are attacking someone above noob level.
Hafen W8? It was used against the noobs mostly. No-one carries the master key, but them. The only chance of yours would be if someone was going outside of the village and got crashed (very unlikely).

How is removing the visitor buff a great idea? It'll ruin the trades, cultural objects, village security in the game, making vulnerable both the trader and the buyer. The worst C&I thread so far.

1. Trades will not be possible, since the people will come to the trade centers and kill other traders. No-on can maintain guards 24/7. No-one can always be online either, to do all the trades face to face. Barterstands are great in that sense, since you may buy and sell items worth for thousands of pts. at any time. We also have faced the problem of in-game items losing their value. If the trades will be even more time-consuming and dangerous, the big traders will stop trading, since there is not much in the game that would interest them. The only reason for them to keep trading is the fun. Having to wait for the client for hours, being scared every time when you open your gates to let the person in, being scared that the trader will get ambushed is not fun.
Trade centers and markets have become a thing only after the visitor buff has been implemented. No-one could maintain a trading place without the place getting vandaled, items getting stolen or someone getting attacked.

2. Villages will not be able to have the areas designated for theft&trespassing only. Simply, you cannot oath anyone to the village without the visitor buff. Otherwise the new person will just catapult your walls within one hour and let the enemy in. Whereas the visitor buff allows you to make sure that the new person won't steal, kill, vandal if you do not want him/her to.

[azrid]

-1
As a shop owner myself I think this is a bad idea.
Only reason I played so much this world is because of visitor buff.

Your main goal here is to punish nubs who are forgetful but the real consequences are far more than that.
Very short sighted of you.

[shubla]

Devs can either make raiding easy, or make it hard.
I think making it hard yields more players.
balance is pretty much impossible.

[LadyGoo]

Devs can either make raiding easy, or make it hard.
I think making it hard yields more players.
balance is pretty much impossible.

Raiding might be hard, true. But you are forgetting that raiding in legacy was impossible (statues, vaults and etc.). The only people who would get hurt were the noobs.