Revamped tutorial suggestion

Thoughts on the further development of Haven & Hearth? Feel free to opine!

Revamped tutorial suggestion

Postby Sevenless » Wed Feb 13, 2019 10:52 am

When I think of a tutorial in haven, I've always thought more along the lines of something that incorporates lore events and is more of a step by step process introducing hearthlings to the core and somewhat unintuitive elements of the game. There may be hotkeys that are specific to amber that aren't in the main game, my apologies for including that but it's been so long I can't tell the default controls apart from custom clients.

I feel like this quest line should be the source of initial XP for new players, with the option to simply abandon anywhere in the quest line and get the remaining XP up front for old players making alts. I know this has a lot of steps, but even the basics of haven require a fair bit of knowledge to understand. I don't feel this takes away the magic of exploring haven, rather I feel this gives players a foundation to explore it from. This doesn't cover the three other basic concepts of combat, wounds, or credos. Given the nature of how the tutorial is completed through the quest system I don't feel any of those topics fit within the scope of the basics. Other than credos they're also mostly event driven which is harder to tutorialize.

I started writing this at 3am, sorry if the lore text wavers in tone/style or is generally uninspired at times.


The world spreads before you, fresh and new. The chirping of insects, the crunching of branches as creatures move unseen but not unheard. An unfamiliar land waits to be discovered

- Discover at least 10 things by right clicking and interacting with objects
- Open your inventory with Tab
- Either pick up an item with left click and left click on the ground to drop it or Ctrl+Left Click to drop it



I've always found it a bit sad that the earliest moments of a player's game are filled with an empty barren world and no particular indication of how to change that or how much lies hidden. Personally I think we need more low level herbs just to flesh the world out for new players. Either way pushing a beginner's exploration up to 4 should reveal 100% of the three basic herbs according to the wiki.


The land seems barren, but it is there really nothing to be found? To see the bounties of the land first you must open your eyes.

- Open the Character sheet by pressing the button on the bottom right or pressing Ctrl+T
- In the Lore and Skills tab purchase foraging
- In the Abilities tab purchase 3 levels of exploration to find more forageables
- Pick a dandelion, taproot, or blueberry by right clicking on it ingame or on the minimap.



As iconic as the birch bark kuksa and in more recent years the birchbark backpack are, I feel like the nature of birch trees being of variable rarity to lead to an inconsistent start. I'd rather see both be made from generic bark to help ease players through what I struggle to call anything other than the "boring empty world" stage of life. For an established player who knows what's coming it's fine, for a new player unsure about the game it's not going to leave a good impression. Also not sure what the default speed switch keys are, mentally modify to your hearts content for that purpose.


Free as the wind, earth gliding beneath your feet, your throat turns to sand. Perhaps there is something that can quench your thirst.

- Find birch bark by picking bark from trees with bright white bark
- Open the crafting menu in the bottom right corner of your screen and craft a birch bark kuksa
- Pick up the kuksa with left click and right click fresh water to fill it
- Try running with shift E to move faster but be warned it uses stamina quickly on some terrain.
- Start walking again with shift W to conserve your energy. Good food to improve your body can be hard to come by.
- Right click and drink from the kuksa to refill your stamina




Although it isn't the most comfortable, a backpack made of bark and string certainly makes carrying your precious berries and rocks easier

- Find enough birchbark and string and craft a birchbark backpack
- Open your Equipment screen on the bottom right of the screen or press Ctrl+E
- Place the backpack in the highlighted spot after you've picked it up or directly onto the ragdoll to equip it




Sticks and stones may break your bones, but these ones make quite a handy tool.

- Chip a stone and pick a branch off a tree if you haven't already and craft a stone axe
- Equip the stone axe through your equipment screen




Wildly crashing through the forest after your quarry might not be the most elegant of hunting tactics, but it is effective. Sometimes.

- Purchase the Hunting skill
- Catch either a chicken, squirrel, or rabbit
- Kill and butcher the animal until you get a bone




With a crash an ancient tree lay felled by your hand. May its greatness not be wasted.

- Purchase the Lumberjacking and Carpentry skills
- Find a bough bearing tree and craft a bonesaw
- Chop a tree down, doing this near fresh water might be a good idea
- Saw four boards
- Place a crate signpost through the build menu and build at least one board into it to keep it the signpost from vanishing




A kindred spirit calls from afar, whisper their name into the flames to draw them to your side.

- If you want friends to play with you, build a wilderness beacon. You may need to discover clay by going to the adventure menu and digging in shallow water first. Right click and name the beacon after it's built, then have your friend whisper it to the deer skull near the wizard when creating a character. If this is done before burning into the world, their hearth fire will appear at the wilderness beacon
- Complete this step of the tutorial by abandoning this quest in the Character sheet's quest log



Honestly I'd like to add a charred blueberry recipe just to make this more flexible but eh.


The forest has bounty if you know where, and how, to look.

- Purchase 3 levels of survival to increase the quality of herbs and animals collected
- Build a fire through the adventure menu in the bottom right.
- Light a fire by crafting a fire brand from the adventure menu and using it on the fire
- Right click to start using the fire and craft roasted meat



I'm always uncomfortable with this particular point due to how the FEP system works in general. Even if the hunger mechanic doesn't exist, but critically so when it does, stuffing a new character's face with random foods (which noobs will certainly do) to get from 5k to 8k energy can really muck up their ability to advance in the early hours when their play is actually quite impactful. It would be a lot less of an issue if hunger wasn't so powerful but we've all seen those arguments a million times by now.


A roaring fire and a satisfying belch do a hearthling good.

- Eat enough food to improve one of your attributes, mouse over and wait for the tooltip to find out what Food Event Points a piece of food gives
- Eat two different types of food in one Food Event Point bar to get a variety bonus
- Eat up to 8000 energy so any hitpoints you might have lost can start healing.




A strange little thing. An oddity in the world, you feel as if contemplating it expands your understanding.

- Pick a dandelion or Craft a cone cow from a conifer cone and branches
- Right click to study or place it in your study report in the Character sheet
- Wait for your curiosity to finish studying and convert some experience points into usable learning points
- Eat food and gain a point of intelligence to increase your attention limit to study more items at the same time





The air blows cold and sharp across the hearthlands. Although it's not much to cut the wind, it's something and it's yours.

- Build a leanto and Dreamcatcher
- Place a container inside the leanto to claim it. It will be harder for others to take your things when inside your claimed leanto, a useful protection for your items while offline.




A place to call home, somewhat safer from prying eyes and grubby fingers.

- Buy the Farming and Will to Power skills to unlock Yeomanry. This quest may take you some time to complete, don't worry if it's taking a while.
- Buy the Yeomanry skill
- Claim a piece of land, be aware this will take 8 hours to fully activate. Others can destroy it during that time if they so choose. Once activated this will give the same protections your leanto does to anything fully inside the claim.
- Build a log cabin
- Place a new hearth fire from the adventure menu using a dream from your dream catcher.
- Buy the Locks and Bolts skill
- Craft a lock and use it on a gate or house door, don't lose the key! Gates can't be picklocked, but doors and chests can.

Last edited by Sevenless on Wed Feb 13, 2019 6:35 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Revamped tutorial suggestion

Postby zebratul » Wed Feb 13, 2019 11:31 am

Massive +1 to a deeper ingame tutorial.

Before this world, i’ve proposed to Jorb that the starting «Burned into the world» quest needs to explain the inheritance mechanic, and using a Spawn Charter.
I’ve also suggested that follow-up quests must be expanded upon unto yeomanry territory with the following steps: create a personal claim, dry a WWW on a rack, build a fence, plant a farm, build a house, build a palisade, tame a livestock maybe.
It must be clear that the main idea is to settle down and protect your own, otherwise stuff will be stolen and/or ransacked.

There are also tonnes of mechanics that are unclear and never mentioned: running with ALT when you have something on a cursor, placing items precisely with CTRL/SHIFT, taming (vaguely through the husbandry skill, who read those descriptions tho), dismounting a boat (i swear this one gets 100% of the newbs stuck, do you want them to ask that on forum and wait? People never google stuff when they panic and are frustrated...).
These are not mentioned in the game and almost impossible to google without knowing what are you looking for. They must be included into the starting quests or via tooltips on lift action, etc.
Just today i've learned that you can cycle your 1-9 hotkeys by pressing CTRL? I wish there was some ingame official documentation for all this.

The game is unplayable without the wiki. New player expirience is very confusing, and there are no links to HDI section of the forum or wiki from the game. Will it break immersion? Somewhat.
But since there are no realm chats for noobs to ask around, they are left in complete darkness.
I got a «will consider» last world. Sadly, no changes.
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Re: Revamped tutorial suggestion

Postby Sevenless » Wed Feb 13, 2019 12:01 pm

zebratul wrote:Massive +1 to a deeper ingame tutorial.

Before this world, i’ve proposed to Jorb that the starting «Burned into the world» quest needs to explain the inheritance mechanic, and using a Spawn Charter.


I think it's fine to explain inheritance for a character after you die for the first time and are making a new one.

I’ve also suggested that follow-up quests must be expanded upon unto yeomanry territory with the following steps: create a personal claim, dry a WWW on a rack, build a fence, plant a farm, build a house, build a palisade, tame a livestock maybe.
It must be clear that the main idea is to settle down and protect your own, otherwise stuff will be stolen and/or ransacked.


I can buy that argument.


There are also tonnes of mechanics that are unclear and never mentioned: running with ALT when you have something on a cursor, placing items precisely with CTRL/SHIFT, taming (vaguely through the husbandry skill, who read those descriptions tho), dismounting a boat (i swear this one gets 100% of the newbs stuck, do you want them to ask that on forum and wait? People never google stuff when they panic and are frustrated...).
These are not mentioned in the game and almost impossible to google without knowing what are you looking for. They must be included into the starting quests or via tooltips on lift action, etc.
Just today i've learned that you can cycle your 1-9 hotkeys by pressing CTRL? I wish there was some ingame official documentation for all this.


That's mostly controls rather than mechanics. A proper controls tab with a full list of them would be enough outside the basics imo (boat/horse dismounting solid point). As for more advanced but not "required" things like animal husbandry, I think it's fine to let players discover it organically by seeing a neighbours animals and asking or checking the forum. The game is still excellent to explore, we just need to give them a platform to work from. Trying to explain everything in the game is going to take way too long and frankly give a bad expectation for how jorb/loftar run the game development.


The game is unplayable without the wiki. New player expirience is very confusing, and there are no links to HDI section of the forum or wiki from the game. Will it break immersion? Somewhat.
But since there are no realm chats for noobs to ask around, they are left in complete darkness.
I got a «will consider» last world. Sadly, no changes.


Alas.
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Re: Revamped tutorial suggestion

Postby dullah » Wed Feb 13, 2019 1:09 pm

good suggestions
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Re: Revamped tutorial suggestion

Postby apoc254 » Wed Feb 13, 2019 5:07 pm

+1 much needed. Perhaps get brand new players feedback on which parts specifically they get hung up on.
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Re: Revamped tutorial suggestion

Postby Ysh » Wed Feb 13, 2019 5:26 pm

I have recently showed game to new player and first thing he does is eat random trash and ruin stats. Next day he tells me that he needs to make new character because he realized he ruined stats. However it is done I think probably the tutorial should not bait player into doing thing that is actively bad.

The proposal in this thread look fairly good, though I think I am still not fond of get 8000% energy goal. If you make this one goal then nab will want to rush to complete it and likely by eating nuts and other bad things. Of course, it is only good way to introduce threshold for healing. I think this issue is indicative that these mechanisms need some tweaks, so it is possible to regain energy without destroying stats/hunger.

I also think that most natural ending for tutorial is things up until yeomanry with goal to build claim and palisade. First thing I will tell every new player is to build claim and wall. These are things that must be done with urgency to have good gameplay experience I think, so that any progress made (items collected, objects built, etc.) is not destroyed when nab will go to sleep and come back tomorrow. Once he has this safety, it will be much easier to allow him to take this game at his own pace and explore the many industries and activities that are in game without giving it all away.
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Re: Revamped tutorial suggestion

Postby Sevenless » Wed Feb 13, 2019 5:47 pm

Ysh wrote:I have recently showed game to new player and first thing he does is eat random trash and ruin stats. Next day he tells me that he needs to make new character because he realized he ruined stats. However it is done I think probably the tutorial should not bait player into doing thing that is actively bad.

The proposal in this thread look fairly good, though I think I am still not fond of get 8000% energy goal. If you make this one goal then nab will want to rush to complete it and likely by eating nuts and other bad things. Of course, it is only good way to introduce threshold for healing. I think this issue is indicative that these mechanisms need some tweaks, so it is possible to regain energy without destroying stats/hunger.


Yeah that's the thing imo. If a mechanic lends itself to beginners ruining themselves maybe it's not a great mechanic.

I also think that most natural ending for tutorial is things up until yeomanry with goal to build claim and palisade. First thing I will tell every new player is to build claim and wall. These are things that must be done with urgency to have good gameplay experience I think, so that any progress made (items collected, objects built, etc.) is not destroyed when nab will go to sleep and come back tomorrow. Once he has this safety, it will be much easier to allow him to take this game at his own pace and explore the many industries and activities that are in game without giving it all away.


The problem with pushing for yeomanry in one go is that it'll probably take the average beginner more than a single play session to complete when you include traditional beginner fucking aroundery and trying to get their friends togther. TBH the wilderness beacon just isn't acceptable from a beginner standpoint. IIRC usually takes me an hour to get 1-2 up, that's an hour where their friends are either wasting time on a character they have to suicide or just aren't playing the game. That tangent aside, you have the issue of LP cost. It's just hard for a starter to get enough for Yeo on day one, doubly so if they do literally anything other than follow a guide step by step.

Much as I want a beginner to end a 2-3 hour playsession on a little claim, it's just not realistic given the current costs/mechanics. That said, a lot of people forget that leantos act as mini claims and make a better natural stopping point for day 1.
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Re: Revamped tutorial suggestion

Postby Ysh » Wed Feb 13, 2019 5:55 pm

Sevenless wrote:
Ysh wrote:I also think that most natural ending for tutorial is things up until yeomanry with goal to build claim and palisade. First thing I will tell every new player is to build claim and wall. These are things that must be done with urgency to have good gameplay experience I think, so that any progress made (items collected, objects built, etc.) is not destroyed when nab will go to sleep and come back tomorrow. Once he has this safety, it will be much easier to allow him to take this game at his own pace and explore the many industries and activities that are in game without giving it all away.


The problem with pushing for yeomanry in one go is that it'll probably take the average beginner more than a single play session to complete when you include traditional beginner fucking aroundery and trying to get their friends togther. TBH the wilderness beacon just isn't acceptable from a beginner standpoint. IIRC usually takes me an hour to get 1-2 up, that's an hour where their friends are either wasting time on a character they have to suicide or just aren't playing the game. That tangent aside, you have the issue of LP cost. It's just hard for a starter to get enough for Yeo on day one, doubly so if they do literally anything other than follow a guide step by step.

Much as I want a beginner to end a 2-3 hour playsession on a little claim, it's just not realistic given the current costs/mechanics. That said, a lot of people forget that leantos act as mini claims and make a better natural stopping point for day 1.

I do not think it is necessary that new player can complete all quests in one session. Addition of leanto mentioning does seem like good idea. As far as beacon is concerned, it seem to me that best solution is to allow group random spawning. Not sure sure about precise implementation and potential for exploits, but at least if a group will like to try the game out, they can all start together. And in the case where one player is already established so he does not like to make new character, then he should be so established that building beacon is not large burden since it really is quite cheap.
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Re: Revamped tutorial suggestion

Postby Sevenless » Wed Feb 13, 2019 6:36 pm

I think there's basically two steps left between what I set out and yeomanry. Wrote up some badly worded quests with the missing steps, god I'm tired. Sorry if it's kind of a hack job but at least I think I have a good outline of what I feel is my vision for the tutorial.

Group spawning should definitely be a thing. Just make it so entering a secret on the skull that doesn't match an ingame wilderness beacon makes the eyes burn blue or something. Anyone entering that secret will spawn on the hearth fire of the first random spawn to use that secret, with the window remaining open for say 45 minutes? After that the group should be able to make wilderness beacons.
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