Animals are so strong!

Thoughts on the further development of Haven & Hearth? Feel free to opine!

Re: Animals are so strong!

Postby Kuddie » Sun Jun 07, 2020 3:42 pm

Chieves wrote:Well, guess I'll git gud and stop being such a "butthurt, raging noob"


This is the best idea you've had so far.
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Re: Animals are so strong!

Postby Headchef » Sun Jun 07, 2020 3:46 pm

Kuddie wrote:
Chieves wrote:Well, guess I'll git gud and stop being such a "butthurt, raging noob"


This is the best idea you've had so far.


+1
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Re: Animals are so strong!

Postby IngloriouslyBad » Sun Jun 07, 2020 7:08 pm

Dude, if you can't punch a fox down and use cliffs to leap over to safety and get your openings down while the dumb animal has to path around for 20 seconds to get to you, I have to agree with alot of people here. Just get better at fighting the animals. Raise your characters skills and your own. If my dumbass could figure it out without anyone to help me, I'm sure your big faction can help you learn how to take down a measly fox.

Get 25-30 UA and use punch - Use cliffs to your advantage - keep your openings below 15-20 if you don't have armor - win
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Re: Animals are so strong!

Postby Chieves » Sun Jun 07, 2020 7:48 pm

IngloriouslyBad wrote:Dude, if you can't punch a fox down and use cliffs to leap over to safety and get your openings down while the dumb animal has to path around for 20 seconds to get to you, I have to agree with alot of people here. Just get better at fighting the animals. Raise your characters skills and your own. If my dumbass could figure it out without anyone to help me, I'm sure your big faction can help you learn how to take down a measly fox.

Get 25-30 UA and use punch - Use cliffs to your advantage - keep your openings below 15-20 if you don't have armor - win


OK, thank you. Just thought it was absurd how strong those things are, I'm not used to that. I tend to stay away from caves now and only sometimes scavenge dead foxes other animals killed. My diet consists of rat kebab. Send help
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Re: Animals are so strong!

Postby Audiosmurf » Sun Jun 07, 2020 10:35 pm

Chieves wrote:
IngloriouslyBad wrote:Dude, if you can't punch a fox down and use cliffs to leap over to safety and get your openings down while the dumb animal has to path around for 20 seconds to get to you, I have to agree with alot of people here. Just get better at fighting the animals. Raise your characters skills and your own. If my dumbass could figure it out without anyone to help me, I'm sure your big faction can help you learn how to take down a measly fox.

Get 25-30 UA and use punch - Use cliffs to your advantage - keep your openings below 15-20 if you don't have armor - win


OK, thank you. Just thought it was absurd how strong those things are, I'm not used to that. I tend to stay away from caves now and only sometimes scavenge dead foxes other animals killed. My diet consists of rat kebab. Send help

The thing is, really, they're not that strong, I suspect you're just misreading it due to how they changed combat stats this world. I can't be bothered to pull up the thread, but it's something like "as long as you have at least half the stats of what you're fighting, your stats are treated as equal, but when they have more than twice your stats they gain an advantage that scales quickly." I think, because of this, a fox is comparatively quite a bit stronger compared to a fresh spawn than they would have been historically.

Did you even have armour?
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NORMALIZE IT
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Re: Animals are so strong!

Postby Chieves » Sun Jun 07, 2020 11:47 pm

Audiosmurf wrote:
Chieves wrote:
IngloriouslyBad wrote:Dude, if you can't punch a fox down and use cliffs to leap over to safety and get your openings down while the dumb animal has to path around for 20 seconds to get to you, I have to agree with alot of people here. Just get better at fighting the animals. Raise your characters skills and your own. If my dumbass could figure it out without anyone to help me, I'm sure your big faction can help you learn how to take down a measly fox.

Get 25-30 UA and use punch - Use cliffs to your advantage - keep your openings below 15-20 if you don't have armor - win


OK, thank you. Just thought it was absurd how strong those things are, I'm not used to that. I tend to stay away from caves now and only sometimes scavenge dead foxes other animals killed. My diet consists of rat kebab. Send help

The thing is, really, they're not that strong, I suspect you're just misreading it due to how they changed combat stats this world. I can't be bothered to pull up the thread, but it's something like "as long as you have at least half the stats of what you're fighting, your stats are treated as equal, but when they have more than twice your stats they gain an advantage that scales quickly." I think, because of this, a fox is comparatively quite a bit stronger compared to a fresh spawn than they would have been historically.

Did you even have armour?


Ah, that makes a lot more sense. I feel kind of pathetic knowing that my stats are far below those of a fox, bird or bat, but I guess I'd need to upgrade my combat stats then. Thanks for clearing it up
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Re: Animals are so strong!

Postby IngloriouslyBad » Mon Jun 08, 2020 1:53 am

fishing will help get you the food you need to you can take on these animals. Spitroast fish, Dry Fish, Cook raw fish, fishwraps. Don't be afraid to raise your int above other stats. INT will get you the LP you need for fighting skills needed to get better foods in your stomach. I learned that the hard way. I had 60 INT and 200 agi con str. Big mistake.
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Re: Animals are so strong!

Postby MadNomad » Mon Jun 08, 2020 12:22 pm

Chieves wrote:Having to go to the forums to get an explanation for how to kill a fox is quite insane

you don't have to do this the people who say it here have figured it out themselves, and even if it wasn't clear, why is it insane?

Chieves wrote:throughout the thread the stat-requirements to kill one magically decreased too, as if I'm in the right.


no they didn't, you have heard different words from different sides, not all people do things the same way because there is more than one way did you know? :roll:

Chieves wrote:Foxes that aren't rabid have no business attacking a human.


and punch is not effective against a bunch of ants, I find it very disturbing that in the game it is actually dangerous to them and it makes the game unplayable to me, perhaps it shouldn't be this effective against them?

Chieves wrote:Perhaps a certain someone should just sit down and think instead of gatekeeping their precious game and insulting me


well you could have said that immediately instead of all the bullshit!
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Re: Animals are so strong!

Postby Chieves » Mon Jun 08, 2020 3:25 pm

MadNomad wrote:
Chieves wrote:Having to go to the forums to get an explanation for how to kill a fox is quite insane

you don't have to do this the people who say it here have figured it out themselves, and even if it wasn't clear, why is it insane?

Chieves wrote:throughout the thread the stat-requirements to kill one magically decreased too, as if I'm in the right.


no they didn't, you have heard different words from different sides, not all people do things the same way because there is more than one way did you know? :roll:

Chieves wrote:Foxes that aren't rabid have no business attacking a human.


and punch is not effective against a bunch of ants, I find it very disturbing that in the game it is actually dangerous to them and it makes the game unplayable to me, perhaps it shouldn't be this effective against them?

Chieves wrote:Perhaps a certain someone should just sit down and think instead of gatekeeping their precious game and insulting me


well you could have said that immediately instead of all the bullshit!


Thank you for your brilliant contribution to a solved thread. You did well
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Re: Animals are so strong!

Postby Apocoreo » Mon Jun 08, 2020 10:14 pm

What this does indicate is that it is not intuitive for new players to have to have foxes, a weak animal in real life, too tough for a beginner. Yeah its a minor setback, but the frustration can result in people who would otherwise git gid quit, losing this game money and potential dev progress.

Theres no clear guide to what creatures you can fight at what level, and I don't think there should be. New players should know to avoid ants, which fight in groups but can be outrun. Bats are shit in many ways, but they make caves scary for new players and according to Jorb that is their purpose so that's fine I guess.

There is no creature you can fight, that fights back, that you can beat at 1au/mc and no armor. There is no introduction to the combat system. So hear me out.

Foxes are the perfect candidate for this, they are small irl, leading new players to believe them weak. They are red and larger than animals that just run, very visible. They do not aggro, another sign of weakness. so nerf foxes and their hats, add a new animal at their current strength. Or do the opposite, in which case I nominate the ignoble raccoon for the role, with a new cosmetic hat called a "Coon Cap"

Finally, top it off by adding a final objective to Ways of the Wild: Defeat a Raccoon/Fox.

Boom. More players, more money, more patches.
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