Advertising Haven.

[Rebs]

So, I recently watched a YouTuber play haven and there were three types of viewers.
1. Those who had no idea about the game
2. Those who have heard about the game but had a hard time finding it.
3. Those who have played it before.

Generally, 1 and 2 had a very common response of "this game sounds great" and 3 were encouraging a lot of the people to play it, and those who hadn't played in a while were surprised that it was still alive and wanted to play again.

This video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYkGzu5 ... l=Nookrium currently has 16k viewers and during the stream, alot of viewers made accounts and joined. (alot I imagine never played it again after the stream)
(if you joined the game due to this stream please comment here would be interesting to see how you are getting on with the game)

Ignoring the fact the population drops off. I don't think Haven has alot of new players signing up however I have met alot more new people since that video was posted.

To get to my question to the devs.. Why isn't Haven advertised anywhere at all and even those looking for Hardcore sandbox survival games cant find this on google.
The player base is out there for this game, I just don't think they know of its existence.

[vatas]

(slightly edited copy-paste that I've been responding to that video with)

Not trying to be mean, but trying to "grab" the kuksa by it's crafting menu icon is pretty bad, can't say devs are at fault here.

Chat is trying to give advice but some like (shift+click to put all in stockpile) is missing crucial context (that seasoned haven player will, unconsciously, fallaciously assume it's obvious) and he fails to figure out you need to grab the the item and right-click correct stockpile while holding shift. Something could be done to explain these basic controls. Also, nobody is telling him to gather Tough Bark from Willows to make Cordage, this is something you're unlikely to figure out, likely assuming all non-birch trees have generic bark.

00.27.24 Now we hit a big one: he assumes spices are required, not optional, when roasting meat. This is perfectly reasonable assumption to make, there's very little to indicate they're optional (tiny gap between "any meat" and "spices") I'd definitely support any reasonable change that would make this more obvious.

00.37.30 I think this was pointed out all the way back in w8 when the new combat system was introduced: lot of people intuitively try to click the icons for moves that appear, having no idea that you use them with number keys.

00.38.30 He noticed, read and understood the KO ping, which to my knowledge is lot more than you can say about several players who've complained about dying to animals or other players because they "kept waking up and getting knocked down"

[Rebs]

(slightly edited copy-paste that I've been responding to that video with)

Not trying to be mean, but trying to "grab" the kuksa by it's crafting menu icon is pretty bad, can't say devs are at fault here.

Chat is trying to give advice but some like (shift+click to put all in stockpile) is missing crucial context (that seasoned haven player will, unconsciously, fallaciously assume it's obvious) and he fails to figure out you need to grab the the item and right-click correct stockpile while holding shift. Something could be done to explain these basic controls. Also, nobody is telling him to gather Tough Bark from Willows to make Cordage, this is something you're unlikely to figure out, likely assuming all non-birch trees have generic bark.

00.27.24 Now we hit a big one: he assumes spices are required, not optional, when roasting meat. This is perfectly reasonable assumption to make, there's very little to indicate they're optional (tiny gap between "any meat" and "spices") I'd definitely support any reasonable change that would make this more obvious.

00.37.30 I think this was pointed out all the way back in w8 when the new combat system was introduced: lot of people intuitively try to click the icons for moves that appear, having no idea that you use them with number keys.

00.38.30 He noticed, read and understood the KO ping, which to my knowledge is lot more than you can say about several players who've complained about dying to animals or other players because they "kept waking up and getting knocked down"

This thread wasn't to point out how hard the game is for new people, more point out the fact that this game has Zero publicity. and I do agree with your points that the game is hard for new people and this discourages a lot of them.
I used the video purely to point out that youtube gave out 16k worth of advertising for free. and I imagine alot of people found haven through that video itself. And Nook said knew of the game but couldn't remember the name/where to find it, until he happened to come across it.

I only assume you mentioned the flaws to point out that it makes the game look bad or to respond to his comments.

[vatas]

Yes, I wish devs could take the time to watch the stream and see how a new player struggles with the game, or at least read the highlights.

More on-topic, I think one of the reasons devs have been hesitant to promote the game is that you can only have one first impression. Of course lot of people fell in love with the game even when it was in rough stages during Legacy (I admit the artstyle back then didn't hurt) but for most people, game needs to have less steep learning curve.

No reason to pay to give the average person impression that game is simply too abstruse.

I may be bit too harsh but as stated in other threads, the person streaming is a connoisseur of indie survival games and he still had problems figuring stuff out.

[Rebs]

Yes, I wish devs could take the time to watch the stream and see how a new player struggles with the game, or at least read the highlights.

More on-topic, I think one of the reasons devs have been hesitant to promote the game is that you can only have one first impression. Of course lot of people fell in love with the game even when it was in rough stages during Legacy (I admit the artstyle back then didn't hurt) but for most people, game needs to have less steep learning curve.

No reason to pay to give the average person impression that game is simply too abstruse.

I may be bit too harsh but as stated in other threads, the person streaming is a connoisseur of indie survival games and he still had problems figuring stuff out.

sure the game has a hard learning curve but they can still advertise the trailer around the place tho

[Ardennesss]

sure the game has a hard learning curve but they can still advertise the trailer around the place tho

Prevailing theory is that they're perfectly happy with the player count and do not want it to increase.

[DDDsDD999]

Low player count is a feature.

[MagicManICT]

My suggestion is to review the live streams jorb and loftar have done, dig around on the forums a bit to search for an answer. Feel free to PM jorb or loftar about the matter if you're still not clear, but from everything I've seen, they're not really clear about the question and any answer is usually "we've thought about it." Word of mouth advertising is fine with them, as it's not an attempt at a commercial project, just a game they want to build for themselves and have opened it up to the rest of the world.

Otherwise, most of the replies in this thread are going to be much like the last few low effort posts just repeating what gets said every time this discussion comes up. (And it comes up about once a year for nearly as long as I've been here.)

[shubla]

Yeah and if you think about the current retention of players in this game, advertising is not very wise usage of money, I think.