Spawn Mechanics Will Deter New Steam Players

[Zampfeo]

Wilderness Beacons are awful even for vets. No one wants to rush carpentry. No one wants to sit there and build them for everyone. No one wants to wait in line for a beacon so they can finally play the game.

These problems are compounded for new players who don't know what skills or discoveries are let alone a Wilderness Beacon and its mechanics.

Many of us discovered Haven for the first time when a Hearth Secret was posted to 4chan/SA/Bay12/wherever else and all we had to do was launch the default client, type in the HS, and immediately spawn with our group. New player acquisition was extremely fluid in those first worlds. It didn't matter if we didn't know what we were doing. We had people in game to socialize with and tell us to start picking branches for LP from the get-go. Now, it's a crapshoot if you can get someone to make a beacon for you on those forums.

I understand spawn from a Hearth Fire was removed to prevent alt spam, but Wilderness Beacons aren't a good alternative.

What if setting your hearth secret allowed new characters to spawn within the same province as your hearth fire? This feature could become disabled for the province as soon as the thingwall is conquered.

[Dawidio123]

Wdym rush carpentry? It's 200 lp. Literally 3 discoveries.

What I do think devs should do is to make an ingame tutorial questthat guides you towards making a beacon (which would incentivize every player to make one for the next person, so in a group everyone would just have to make one), ofc that leaves you always with one extra beacon but it is what it is, you can use it for an alt.

[Vraatjuh]

Not sure if the devs should spend time on this. This is only relevant the first 30~60 minutes of the world.

I agree it would help for new players to get more information regarding spawning friends, but I guess 90% of this game could use more/better tutorials for new players.

[Dawidio123]

Not sure if the devs should spend time on this. This is only relevant the first 30~60 minutes of the world.

I agree it would help for new players to get more information regarding spawning friends, but I guess 90% of this game could use more/better tutorials for new players.

I mean imo there should be quests that lead you to making a beacon/personal claim/palisade. For veterans it's basic shit and free lp, for new players it would give them some guidance, because there SHOULD be some indication that you should dry hides ASAP and then turn them into leather ASAP. And LP is more constraining for new players that take skills randomly so that would help them too, it's not like 1-2k lp is a diff for someone who quests anyways to get rage in 2h.

[noindyfikator]

This is only relevant the first 30~60 minutes of the world.

This world I spawned +- 200 alts, for sure it wasn't 30-60 minutes ;p

Simple spitroast "chore" requires to have at least 5-10 alts and there are way more activities in the game that require alts

[Vraatjuh]

I mean imo there should be quests that lead you to making a beacon/personal claim/palisade. For veterans it's basic shit and free lp, for new players it would give them some guidance, because there SHOULD be some indication that you should dry hides ASAP and then turn them into leather ASAP. And LP is more constraining for new players that take skills randomly so that would help them too, it's not like 1-2k lp is a diff for someone who quests anyways to get rage in 2h.

Yeah, I was reacting to OP. I agree there should be more and better tutorial quests. But I don't see them implenting that properly in the coming month before release.

This world I spawned +- 200 alts, for sure it wasn't 30-60 minutes ;p

Simple spitroast "chore" requires to have at least 5-10 alts and there are way more activities in the game that require alts

It was specifically aimed at OP's first sentence, complaing about waiting in line and somebody having to get carpentry and build them. I don't feel sorry for anyone making 200 alts for various chores having to do that. That's the least amount of effort you can put in. No need to make that easier imo.

[Zampfeo]

Yes, it is only relevant for the first 30-60 minutes, but that's long enough to immediately turn people off of the game. Additionally, new players aren't going to understand that only one person can make the initial Wilderness Beacon and that they need to recreate their characters. It is extremely unintuitive and I don't think a tutorial alone will solve the issue.

Imagine a group of 5 completely new players. They all create their characters at the same time. They're immediately confused about how to play together. They figure out how to kin each other and create a party. They now have arrows pointing in all different directions. They all leisurely progress the tutorial while aimlessly following the arrows. It takes 60 minutes for the first player to get to the part about building a Wilderness Beacon. Suddenly, it dawns on them that the other 4 players have completely wasted the last 60 minutes and have to recreate their characters. Most sane people delete the game at this point.

[Dawidio123]

Yes, it is only relevant for the first 30-60 minutes, but that's long enough to immediately turn people off of the game. Additionally, new players aren't going to understand that only one person can make the initial Wilderness Beacon and that they need to recreate their characters. It is extremely unintuitive and I don't think a tutorial alone will solve the issue.

Imagine a group of 5 completely new players. They all create their characters at the same time. They're immediately confused about how to play together. They figure out how to kin each other and create a party. They now have arrows pointing in all different directions. They all leisurely progress the tutorial while aimlessly following the arrows. It takes 60 minutes for the first player to get to the part about building a Wilderness Beacon. Suddenly, it dawns on them that the other 4 players have completely wasted the last 60 minutes and have to recreate their characters. Most sane people delete the game at this point.

Those same players would spawn in anyways without understanding the fact they can use a hs to spawn in the same province.
Make the quest for beacon the first quest that pops up and you at least have some ingame explanation of the mechanic.
And what about late game? When every province is claimed? Should players joining a long-term world not be able to group up?

[DDDsDD999]

What if setting your hearth secret allowed new characters to spawn within the same province as your hearth fire? This feature could become disabled for the province as soon as the thingwall is conquered.

This makes a lot of sense, and is probably the solution alt spam can abuse the least.

I don't see a reason for disabling it when the thingwall is conquered by a realm. Just disable it when the thingwall is being challenged by a siege challenge or realm challenge.

The character should have to discover the thingwall first though, otherwise someone could just map out thingwalls by placing a hf when they enter the province and spawning an alt right on the thingwall. Since new players default spawn on thingwalls, it's only an issue if they move a full province away. Though even this abuse case is only relevant because the thingwall tracking magic is too expensive and should be basically free, like 10 exp.

[dafels]

I kinda liked the spawning when you could just type in a heartsecret and spawn next to the target hf back in the day, but there were some different issues with it