Botting api

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Re: Botting api

Postby xdragonlord18 » Tue Mar 20, 2018 3:05 pm

LostJustice wrote:
xdragonlord18 wrote:
LostJustice wrote:I value my time. If you ever studied or spent time actually learning coding you would understand one of the most powerful tools a language can offer to a programmer is a print statement. I don't know anyone who doesn't use a print a statement to see what is going on, or at least some sort of logging which I have both. It seems you just want a hand me down of the code rather than actually spending valued time in actually learning it and doing it which in the end doesn't seem like you value your time but rather seems like your plain lazy.

It isn't like I spent my valuable time creating a tutorial in answering about 90% of your current issues in this thread or offer a neutral discord to all people where people can learn how to work on the client which many others with initiative actually use on a daily basis. Simply stated, your naive and I wish you luck in ever working with others because it doesn't seem that you just have issues actually handling coding conventions and simple problems but also seems you have issues working with people and actually asking for help on how to do things and learn things so you can spend your time more wisely by coding rather than complaining. But it seems like I don't know how to value time since I got bots handling majority of my time intensive repetitive tasks for in game and even in real life.

As back to the current topic of this thread. I personally pondered giving out a botting api but always ended up backing away from the idea. I always wanted to level the playing ground between certain factions as well as provide the community with a set of options to handle daily tasks to hopefully increase some other aspects of the game play. Every time I consider this topic however, I back away from it because being a player from world 3 and 4, I have seen some of the destruction that bots can do to a world if miss handled and I just don't believe every individual should be given this privilege to abuse them. People who usually use them now, for the most part took time to learn to do these tasks and also therefor have a bit more respect for the tools they are using and mostly understand the impact they have on the current community. So rather than releasing an API I think is better to teach people rather than just hand them the tool.


one of the most powerful tools isnt the print statement u dunce its the debugger and im not a fan of sitting there smashing my head against the code with the debugger like a neanderthal documentation isnt hand me down code wtf kind of fucked idea is that u ape i have bad news for u kid im already working with people its my job and i do it well if u think loftars code follows any common form of code convention then ur a lunatic how about instead of needing to ask the community how to do something i just consult the documentation like a professional would except i cant because there is no documentation i think ur problem with documentation is that u dont know how to use it that would fit the narrative of u using print statements instead of proper debugging tools and really maybe u should have bots doing less things for u since it seems ur forgetting how to think ur like my teammate who i have to tutor endlessly because they never learned how to read the documentation or program properly ive never met a competent programmer that thought documentation was in any way lazy the amount of people saying documentation isnt something that should b release just illustrates the quality of the average developer on this fourm i dont think that current bot developers limit their botting behavior because they understand the impact they have on the community but rather because they dont know how to make their bots any better i dont want another api i want documentation


To be honest, you need to document your normal English sentences with some punctuation. I also don't know who you are at all other than an internet troll who probably failed English class several times. And I have doubts that you even work in the field because from everything you just stated, you obviously don't understand the mechanics of how a debugger even came to be and how a print statement forms the very essence of it. And I already documented all my code in Javadocs on my own private repository of my API, I believe in documentation but such is life when everything isn't just handed to you. Also, I am not afraid to ask for help or how to do something because I do admit I don't know everything and when documentation is not there, I don't weep and cry about it. I just ask someone who has spent the time learning. And knowing the community and seeing some of the clients, I can say for sure that there is a lot of powerful APIs and if someone is at the stage at making a functional API and plugin loader, I don't have any doubts that they couldn't produce an effective API.

And from your lack of grammar and spelling, one thing that any Job looks for is the ability to effectively communicate with others for these exact reasons which it seems you lack. Maybe try working on that because otherwise your statements honestly just look disgraceful hence why I only bother reading this topic once a week.

i think there r plenty of documents on the use of english but i dont think any of those rules r important im not weeping and crying about no documentation lmao i just said that loftar should release documentation and every autist on this forum comes swooping in to say what a sin it is to ask for standards every job is also going to look for someone with the ability to think critically which is something that u definitely lack i am so sorry that my statements look disgraceful to some idiot kid on this obscure internet forum
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Re: Botting api

Postby Granger » Tue Mar 20, 2018 3:49 pm

xdragonlord18 wrote:... i dont think ... ... im ... just ... autist ... swooping in ... to ask for ... the ability to think ... ... i am ... sorry ... disgraceful ... idiot kid ...

That's what people extract when skimming (as it's unreadable) the gibberish you excrete. Stop being lazy if you want to be taken seriously.
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Re: Botting api

Postby LostJustice » Tue Mar 20, 2018 4:03 pm

Granger wrote:
xdragonlord18 wrote:... i dont think ... ... im ... just ... autist ... swooping in ... to ask for ... the ability to think ... ... i am ... sorry ... disgraceful ... idiot kid ...

That's what people extract when skimming (as it's unreadable) the gibberish you excrete. Stop being lazy if you want to be taken seriously.


Agreed, exactly what I read.
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Re: Botting api

Postby xdragonlord18 » Tue Mar 20, 2018 4:16 pm

LostJustice wrote:
Granger wrote:
xdragonlord18 wrote:... i dont think ... ... im ... just ... autist ... swooping in ... to ask for ... the ability to think ... ... i am ... sorry ... disgraceful ... idiot kid ...

That's what people extract when skimming (as it's unreadable) the gibberish you excrete. Stop being lazy if you want to be taken seriously.


Agreed, exactly what I read.

Granger wrote:
xdragonlord18 wrote:... i dont think ... ... im ... just ... autist ... swooping in ... to ask for ... the ability to think ... ... i am ... sorry ... disgraceful ... idiot kid ...

That's what people extract when skimming (as it's unreadable) the gibberish you excrete. Stop being lazy if you want to be taken seriously.


im sorry i thought u guys were native english speakers my bad in the end i dont think either of ur understandings hinge on my use of minor grammatical rules u guys rnt exactly competent indivduals after all even young children can understand what i type
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Re: Botting api

Postby romovs » Tue Mar 20, 2018 9:44 pm

LostJustice wrote:
shubla wrote:
LostJustice wrote:As back to the current topic of this thread. I personally pondered giving out a botting api but always ended up backing away from the idea. I always wanted to level the playing ground between certain factions as well as provide the community with a set of options to handle daily tasks to hopefully increase some other aspects of the game play. Every time I consider this topic however, I back away from it because being a player from world 3 and 4, I have seen some of the destruction that bots can do to a world if miss handled and I just don't believe every individual should be given this privilege to abuse them. People who usually use them now, for the most part took time to learn to do these tasks and also therefor have a bit more respect for the tools they are using and mostly understand the impact they have on the current community. So rather than releasing an API I think is better to teach people rather than just hand them the tool.

Game is currently being actively developed. I think if bots would bring destruction to hearthlands, devs would have to fix them. Maybe you could collaborate with somebody and do client not-alone.


I do collaborate with people but even then I am selective on that for a reason. Issue is yes they can “fix” it but does this entail a world reset? Making something more complicated so newer people have even a harder learning curve to understand a mechanic just to prevent botting? Or does it entail reworking a system like FEP which would make it harder for new players and the people who already used the system already reaped the benefits before the change? Or would this issue turn into something similar to popular MMOs like RuneScape and dark ages where botting became the Community and then killed it? Or the game becomes only bot to win where every hearthlings you meet may be infact 90% of the time a bot? Things like that is what I asked myself before I release my API. Botting by all means is useful and something I would like to give out but dealing with those consequences is the reality you face when releasing a botting API.

There are people to ask if you are persistent and want to automate things that are there to help achieve these goals if you want it that bad and there are few including myself that have fully working api and scripts but just giving a script and api out can cause major problems which should be thought of before hand.

I haven't read most of this thread, but the mention of RuneScape couch my eye.
RuneScape is not really comprable to H&H. Botting in RuneScape was a culmination of flawed mechanics and significantly higher user base than H&H. Which eventually led to commercialization of botting, as in people making six digits a year from selling their bots at marketplaces. At least before 2014-2015 or so when they started to deal with the issue seriously.
H&H on other hand is quiet different. All the current stuff that gets botted is trivially solved by simple mechanics change and there is simply not enough userbase for it to become an serious issue. Dunno what's up with all the hysteria about bots tbh.
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Re: Botting api

Postby shubla » Tue Mar 20, 2018 9:51 pm

romovs wrote:. All the current stuff that gets botted is trivially solved by simple mechanics change and there is simply not enough userbase for it to become an serious issue.

I guess it depends on what mechanic change would mean.
Everything that requires simple repeating is bottable. They woudl have to completely get rid of farming as it is for example.
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Re: Botting api

Postby romovs » Tue Mar 20, 2018 9:58 pm

Or just make it user-friendly. I.e. automatic replant after harvest plus automatic stockpiling.
There aren't really that many bots which are currently used by top factions and other nerds. Farming, crafting, basement mining, foraging, etc. is solvable by making improvements to the mechanics but without completely redoing it.
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Re: Botting api

Postby shubla » Tue Mar 20, 2018 10:47 pm

romovs wrote:Or just make it user-friendly. I.e. automatic replant after harvest plus automatic stockpiling.
There aren't really that many bots which are currently used by top factions and other nerds. Farming, crafting, basement mining, foraging, etc. is solvable by making improvements to the mechanics but without completely redoing it.

We got server side autoharvesting in haven v2, maybe we will get server side autoplanting in the next haven "re-write"
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Re: Botting api

Postby Ardennesss » Wed Mar 21, 2018 1:38 am

shubla wrote:
romovs wrote:Or just make it user-friendly. I.e. automatic replant after harvest plus automatic stockpiling.
There aren't really that many bots which are currently used by top factions and other nerds. Farming, crafting, basement mining, foraging, etc. is solvable by making improvements to the mechanics but without completely redoing it.

We got server side autoharvesting in haven v2, maybe we will get server side autoplanting in the next haven "re-write"



I doubt it. Jorb has repeatedly stated to his primary opposition to automation is that the easier he makes it for someone to perform a task, the more they will just upscale to match the decreased difficulty. And in my experience, he's not entirely wrong. My first thought if he vastly improved how easy it is to farm, is oh hey I can expand my fields now because it's easier.
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Re: Botting api

Postby LostJustice » Wed Mar 21, 2018 5:06 am

romovs wrote:Or just make it user-friendly. I.e. automatic replant after harvest plus automatic stockpiling.
There aren't really that many bots which are currently used by top factions and other nerds. Farming, crafting, basement mining, foraging, etc. is solvable by making improvements to the mechanics but without completely redoing it.


Tbh, there isn't that many because the main repeatable tasks are done, farming being a major one. Issue is why I mentioned Runescape is because as soon as Runescape let botting get out of hand to the point where Jagex tried doing something about it, it was too late. The market was flooded with botted goods, players quit or already had massive cash stacks from bots. Game was in a state where many left. Yeah you can change a simple mechanic but at what cost? Even if something is server side and you make it user friendly, I will just create a bot to manually start the user sided friendly handled automation at different intervals so I don't need to worry or log on. Or, ok you make the task a bit harder like trellis farming, but honestly in my own API right now, it just as easy as handling normal crops, just need a separate script to replant or work the separate script into an extension for trellis. But otherwise, I agree with you but the changing mechanics isn't a solution unless they change it every month and then what is the cost of that? Players who don't know how to play, harder learning curves, or even just no one wanting to do it anymore?
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