The Anvil & Hammer(Game Idea Outlining Board)

Thoughts on the further development of Haven & Hearth? Feel free to opine!

The Anvil & Hammer(Game Idea Outlining Board)

Postby ChainedDjinn » Sun Aug 10, 2014 10:56 pm

This is my first topic, so I can only hope that I can do this right.

This topic is for game designs or mechanisms that haven't been thought out fully or cover far more topics then what C&I stipulate is acceptable. The Purpose of this thread is to refine the ideas into a more concise, eloquent and informative format. On top of this, break down ideas into individual topics allowing people to state their mind then following through with polishing from help.
I've done a few searches and it seems nobody has broached the topic of sorting out ideas since at least last year, I believe taking a fresh start on this might be good for the overall of the forums.

In short this Topic can be thought of as the 'mouth' before reaching C&I making the new topics much easier to digest.

Now most topics have a few rules, so I think some should be put here;

1;Mechanisms that jeopardize the nature of the game would probably be overlooked, So it probably wouldn't make much point discussing.
2;Working on an idea prior to submitting it would be wise, a well thought out and balanced idea would outweigh something someone envisioned.
3;Keep in mind your idea may be subjected to change, this doesn't have to be a bad thing. Just be sure to accept or reject it as is and don't start a war over it.
4;The ultimate goal of any discussion here, is to make something(s) worth posting at C&I that can be read and understood easily.

Some proof readers and word weavers would be appreciated if they participated in this endeavor, the sleeker and more stylish the better the ride. 8-)

I'd normally take this chance as OP and throw up a cascade of my own ideas, but I've done that before. I feel this would be better suited to help other people formulate their overall ideas rather then promote my own.
Not everyone here speaks English, so helping people with a good idea out with a few lingual adaptations mind you, would streamline the process I believe.
I would also be learning better sentence structure, allowing me to elaborate on my own ideas later. :)

Before the mods condemn this thread though, I would like to debate in it's defense.
As it is now, the C&I section is wrought with a lot of vague ideas about varied subjects. Some people are even unsure what it is that they want, just that it be something better. In this format it makes if difficult to express oneself without breaking at least one rule here or there.
I create this Topic in order for maintenance of the C&I to be much less of a burden.
If I am wrong in doing this, please describe how so that we may be able to coordinate a compromise.
Thank you in advance.

Well, I don't want to build this wall too high. So I declare the Anvil & Hammer open for suggestions!
Till our... first, discussion. ;)
The masquerade arrives with nary a sound, all will find in their laws they are bound.
Tipping the scales and teaching justice to see, only in true death can one honestly be free.
But some of us are stubborn, while others try to talk shit. But I hope I speak for most of us, that we just don't know when to quit.
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Re: The Anvil & Hammer(Game Idea Outlining Board)

Postby overtyped » Sun Aug 10, 2014 11:06 pm

Bob Dole thinks you are overthinking too much, and this should still be in critique and ideas.
Bob Dole, world first Whale Killer! viewtopic.php?f=80&t=75087
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Re: The Anvil & Hammer(Game Idea Outlining Board)

Postby borka » Mon Aug 11, 2014 1:17 am

Well *hicks* overthinking and talking *burps* about stuff is immanent at Inns ... *slurp* - oi Innkeeper another pitcher please ;)
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Re: The Anvil & Hammer(Game Idea Outlining Board)

Postby Ninijutsu » Mon Aug 11, 2014 1:18 am

borka wrote:Well *hicks* overthinking and talking *burps* about stuff is immanent at Inns ... *slurp* - oi Innkeeper another pitcher please ;)

wow you are a really clever guy borka please autograph my napkin
Of another era.
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Re: The Anvil & Hammer(Game Idea Outlining Board)

Postby borka » Mon Aug 11, 2014 1:21 am

can't write *wuff* ;)
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Re: The Anvil & Hammer(Game Idea Outlining Board)

Postby McJager » Mon Aug 11, 2014 3:50 am

Honestly I think the Lp system and death have been pretty well covered. I know you said you didn't want to start off with your own ideas but I'm interested in the whole personal beliefs revamp at the moment. Everyone says it needs work and it's not that useful. For example the death and life slider. No one picks the death one due to it being just complete garbage.. The day and night slider, Also kind of pointless. Well, That's my opening arugments at the moment. As to how they could be changed I'd love to see some suggestions before I put in my own.
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Re: The Anvil & Hammer(Game Idea Outlining Board)

Postby ChainedDjinn » Mon Aug 11, 2014 4:08 pm

McJager wrote:Honestly I think the Lp system and death have been pretty well covered. I know you said you didn't want to start off with your own ideas but I'm interested in the whole personal beliefs revamp at the moment. Everyone says it needs work and it's not that useful. For example the death and life slider. No one picks the death one due to it being just complete garbage.. The day and night slider, Also kind of pointless. Well, That's my opening arguments at the moment. As to how they could be changed I'd love to see some suggestions before I put in my own.


You do make some good points, though I myself in the beginning actually did have my character toward death. The added HHP damage didn't seem to counter balance the added HHP gain, so I can understand why people wouldn't endorse it.
The fact their called 'Personal Beliefs' should entail they are in fact personal to the individual and sort of unique to them. This could be used to find out who the character is and how they could relate to others, this of course going by the prospect of you being their guide, not them.
People are eating this up in games like Tamagotchi Life, they put in their own characters but then said toon starts acting different then they envisioned. This makes for hilarious outcomes that sometimes creates new ideas and alternative version stories, which is lasting fun for the people who know them.

Another thing to address is making it so some people don't want full this or full that on those sliders. To do this you simply make a reward and restraint system, if they want more of 'A' then they need to give up being able to make 'G' or so on. Let me illustrate;

You have a bar with about 17 segments much like the sliders now. In the middle your free to do as you please, no reward, no restraint. Moving it to one side, you harvest more plant life like produce of seeds much like the 'Nature' slider. But in contrast, when this character butchers they get less meat. Vice-versa if you choose the other path.
Now this is where things deviate, after you go over 5 clicks in either direction your characters going to refuse the opposite task more firmly. The reason for this is simple, raw meats can contaminate the farmers plants, meanwhile a butcher isn't gonna want their meat getting dirty.
Using this kinda system there can still be a Jack of all trades, but it limits the Jacks effectiveness overall.
If approached with finesse, this can be iterated into other contrasting aspects as well. (Like if a character enjoys being surrounded by life or death. Flowers or corpses.)

This ties into the idea of the LA being linked to current (Active) happiness rather then a (static) slider. This would sadly in the games present state favor people who play more, so lets address that.
Keeping your character happy while off line, well a bed would make me happy. So good beds with Q values would keep characters happier when they slept, dream catchers would also be favorable. (These things are technically supposed to catch bad dreams, so that you get the good ones.) Maybe if the characters a hunter you can make trophies, like a mounted deer head(Antlers?) or a Bear pelt rug. On the contrary, a person loving life might want pets and plants in their house. (I am not living next to the creepy old cat lady! That's a no! :x ) This would stimulate economy in my opinion as it adds a use to a system already in the game and all the furniture facilitates that purpose! Now the system would have to be reworked a little, can't have too many of the same easy item add too much. That's what testings for though.

Well, that's my thoughts. I would love to hear if anyone else has some suggestions that could improve this.
Till next time
The masquerade arrives with nary a sound, all will find in their laws they are bound.
Tipping the scales and teaching justice to see, only in true death can one honestly be free.
But some of us are stubborn, while others try to talk shit. But I hope I speak for most of us, that we just don't know when to quit.
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Re: The Anvil & Hammer(Game Idea Outlining Board)

Postby McJager » Mon Aug 11, 2014 4:59 pm

Off topic a moment but you sparked me wanting to state that I would love a few more decorative items in game, The trophies idea especially seems cool. Except I think if something like that was implemented only someone who actually killed the animal should be able to turn it into a trophy. Which would be cool in regards to a troll. As for the personal beliefs system specifically the nature industry slider, I'm ok with how that particular one works to an extent, But I think like you said it should apply to a wider range of things like hunting, Fishing, Foraging, Etc. All that nature crap and industry should apply to anything they deemed an act of industry, Such as crafting a bed and building a house and such.

Personal beliefs have needed a revamp for a while now in my opinion, How many people actually touch the day and night slider? As to what we could do with that... Well it would probably be easier to replace what it does than replacing the slider entirely, Perhaps have it so that at night you're able to see certain resources or forageables that someone who's day aligned wouldn't, And vice versa. Suppose it could also be viewed as a moral alignment thing and within certain parameters effect actions... Still working on the idea in my head so bare with me if it seems a bit random and disorganized.
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Re: The Anvil & Hammer(Game Idea Outlining Board)

Postby ChainedDjinn » Tue Aug 19, 2014 12:06 am

McJager wrote:Off topic a moment but you sparked me wanting to state that I would love a few more decorative items in game, The trophies idea especially seems cool. Except I think if something like that was implemented only someone who actually killed the animal should be able to turn it into a trophy. Which would be cool in regards to a troll.


I thought some people would like to adorn their homes with other various degrees of furniture. Sadly I don't think it would do any good to limit who makes it though, J&L have already mentioned things to this regard. Anything one person can do, someone else should also have access too. Besides, being able to use your friends kill to make them a trophy for them would be awesome in my opinion.

McJager wrote: As for the personal beliefs system specifically the nature industry slider, I'm ok with how that particular one works to an extent, But I think like you said it should apply to a wider range of things like hunting, Fishing, Foraging, Etc. All that nature crap and industry should apply to anything they deemed an act of industry, Such as crafting a bed and building a house and such.


Well, I'd actually thought dividing the nature/industry slider into something a little broader. Something along the lines of socialist/soloist to tell if your happier with a group or on your own, or nomad/settler for if your character prefers life on the road or in a village with buildings. (Give wagons more of an ability to defend themselves or something.)
As I see it, the sliders as they are now seem a bit broken. I mean, everyone just puts everything to one side anyway, so how does this make the belief personnel? Besides, nature has more to it then hunting, fishing and foraging. Being attuned with nature should be more like being a part of nature, befriending the animals and learning the secrets of the deepest woods. Maybe a sort of magic system added to it, or learning rare forms of combat that aren't normally attainable.(Too much kung-fu panda and Quest for Camelot.)
In short, I believe the sliders should represent more about who you are then what you get.(Having hidden functions to counteract pros would make it more interesting.)


McJager wrote:Personal beliefs have needed a revamp for a while now in my opinion, How many people actually touch the day and night slider? As to what we could do with that... Well it would probably be easier to replace what it does than replacing the slider entirely, Perhaps have it so that at night you're able to see certain resources or forageables that someone who's day aligned wouldn't, And vice versa. Suppose it could also be viewed as a moral alignment thing and within certain parameters effect actions... Still working on the idea in my head so bare with me if it seems a bit random and disorganized.


I like this idea, maybe something like a Nocturnal/Diurnal where you get a bonus or penalty to sight range and/or pierce the stealth of others as well? Maybe your character gets tired more often in the day then night? Maybe it's the element they embrace more? Who knows maybe all of them combined!
The moral aspect is an interesting take, makes me think it has a fear attachment or something. Both night and day can induce fear; night because you can't see anything else and day because everything can see you. Could also branch into the realm of psychosis or physical reactions, like feeling claustrophobic of the dark or something along the lines of cave adaptation, where your character gets sick being in sunlight the farther in night the slider's ticked.
Could be used for a later installment if Jorb ever wants to introduce vampires. :lol:

Well, those are my thoughts. I wonder why no one else has joined in on this? I thought a couple days would be enough time, maybe people aren't really interested. That or real life gets in the way. XP
I'll try to keep this place open for as long as I can, as long as theirs ideas to fine-tune, my forge will stay lit!
Oh! I also thought of something very interesting regarding a possible quest function, lemme know if anyone's interested.

Till our next chat.
The masquerade arrives with nary a sound, all will find in their laws they are bound.
Tipping the scales and teaching justice to see, only in true death can one honestly be free.
But some of us are stubborn, while others try to talk shit. But I hope I speak for most of us, that we just don't know when to quit.
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Re: The Anvil & Hammer(Game Idea Outlining Board)

Postby Tonkyhonk » Tue Aug 19, 2014 1:17 am

ChainedDjinn wrote:Some people are even unsure what it is that they want, just that it be something better.

exactly describing this thread... what is the point of this?
this sounds like its gonna make a lot harder for everyone to check on and search for previous suggestions.
in short, dont suggest when you dont know what it is that you want. chat elsewhere.

Forum Rule wrote:Please avoid making grab bag threads with multiple unrelated suggestions. Give each idea its own thread so posters can discuss its merits, so that ideas aren't overshadowed by more popular ideas, and so that they might be found later using the search tool.
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