On the Game: Siege weapons, stone walls and epic sieges

[Bigfish]

Though the old thread is dead more than a half year i open a new one.

i was thinkin, dont know what skill this should branch from but siege equipment, such as ballista, catapults and rams should be makeable at a siege workshop[basically like a quern but expensive, needs loads of bricks and boards and bla bla bla, when you want to craft something you right click then craft, no interior]. After it is constructed it should act much like a cart, as you should be able to drag it. After dragging and positioning it, you can fire it, you can use stone for catapults and giant arrows[made at siege workshop] , it should gradually do damage to palisades, walls, fences, and tall walls.
Tall walls should use twice the amount of resources as a regular wall, as they should be twice as tall. I think you should be able to add rooms to a house, visible on the outside and inside. You could put furniture like beds or couches that if right clicked you sit or lie on, if you logout on a bed you gain sleep, wich is like hunger exept you dont constantly have munchies from smoking weed in secret. Anyway sleep also raises the happy meter, if you lose to much sleep you get sad, and eventually depressed, this causes you to regen health quite slowly and almost no endurance, crafting should also take longer in depression.

Note: I fully expect the devs to ignore this and add whatever the hell they feel like, though. It's their game, after all.

The problem is that building up something utilize far more time at the moment than griefing/destroying. Jorb mentioned that in one of his posts.

Now my ideas to make building up more valuable (some maybe old/mentioed though):
1. Fences for instance will be destructable like there are now.

2. To destroy palisade walls you now need battering rams. These can simply be cut out of a tree (or need a lot of blocks), only harm palisades(fences) and are carried by 2-8 people. The more people carry the rams the faster the wall will be destroyed. For example 2 persons need two hours , 4 need one hour and 8 need a half hour.
Rams can be only build by people with a decent level of carpentry.

3. Brickwalls &Gates can be destroyed by catapults which are build in a siege engine workshop (a lot of blocks and stones needed) as suggested above. Metal-strengthened battering rams (with protecting roof) can only destroy brickwall gates. Catapults/MSBR need boards and wrought iron (or steel but that may be a bit costly) and its movement speed is like the actual cart movment so you will most likely be forced to build the workshop near the opposing town. One catapult will need several hours to destroy one segment of brickwall. Though you may build more to increase destruction speed. Catapults will break easily through palisade walls for obvious reasons.
You need a high level of carpentry to build catapults.

4. Stone walls are several tiles deep and you can walk on them and shot down arrows (they may get extra dmg n accuracy). You need a lot of stones (maybe we get stone blocks some day) for them. Stone walls can be boarded with very slow and very costly siege towers or destroyed with trebuchets. Although stone walls can only be build by the master builders of a kingdom (are announced by kingof 5+ united citys [fixed, why should a king build walls ?!]). Trebuchets will need several hours to destroy one segment of stone wall but will break easily through brickwalls/palisade. You need very high level of carpentry to build siege towers.
Stairs on the wall could be implemented like cellar doors if its otherwise too hard to code.


Conclusion: On the one hand this would reduce griefing to a healthy stage, enforce teamwork and (may) be a lot more fun. On the other hand this would constrain griefing hermits.

[Potjeh]

I've mostly expressed my views on this here. But yeah, I'd like to see siege weapons too.

[Chakravanti]

I wouldn't reduce griefing but should like to see brick walls be powerful enough to withstand days of handbashing by strong (300-500str) toons. Siege engines force the enemy to set up shop and start hammering away at the walls. Giving constituants half an hour at least to get things around and mount a resistance.

The one problem you will encounter is sieging toons waiting at a gate for resistance fighters to exit and meet and thus...get inside the city. It occurs to me that making crossroads indestructible would well and solve this problem. That might give rise to a host of other problems but the solution is pretty simple, make them *optionally* indestructible as a function of authority.

[Potjeh]

If ranged weapons were actually useful for PvP and the walls gave the defenders a bonus of some kind, people wouldn't be eager to camp gates.

[Jackard]

The more people carry the rams the faster the wall will be destroyed. For example 2 persons need two hours , 4 need one hour and 8 need a half hour.

One catapult will need several hours to destroy one segment of brickwall.

An alternative to having these things take an arbitrary number of hours, one that might be more interesting, is to allow land to be seized using Authority and make siege weapons only function on territory under your control.

So it kind of becomes like a game of Risk.

[vikingdragons]

i really like this idea. stronger walls, seige machines, wide walls that give ranged attack bonuses. I also think there should be an option to add a turret to the wall (not the machine gun kind, the actually wall turret kind that looks like this -_-_-_-) these turrets could also provide a large chance of ranged attacks missing, where as the turret-less wall would only have a small chance of causing rocks and arrows to miss. And defenitly add towers to the walls! maybe make them an attchment to corners. for instance: a palisade corner could have a simple platform and ladder. a brick corner could have a bucket-shaped top and a ladder, and if a stone wall is created, it could havea hut with either a ladder, or doors. The brick (and stone) one could have a special seige defense added to it. these would be smaller, cheaper, and weaker, but require the attachment to place them on. You could have a small catapult that fires lots of stones instead of a boulder, and a small ballista that shoots smaller projectiles than a siege ballista.

now, if seige engines are ever implemented, then a trebuchet needs to be an option. it requires a shit-ton of resources, takes forver to build, and is immobile, but has a huge range and massive damage. and an arc, so you could actually shoot it over walls!!! rain of stone death!!!!

and, the risk idea, eh, i beleive that as been suggested and shot down many times, and this is because a lot of ppl prefer live-action to time-based or turn-based ideas.

[Jackard]

and, the risk idea, eh, i believe that has been suggested and shot down many times

sources please.

this is because a lot of ppl prefer live-action to time-based or turn-based ideas.

hmmmm:

2 person ram need two hours , 4 need one hour and 8 need a half hour. catapult will need several hours

trebuchet requires a shit-ton of resources, takes forver to build, and is immobile,

sounds to me like you didnt give it a lot of thought

[vikingdragons]

i believe that has been suggested and shot down many times

sources please.

i dont really which threads in specific, but i do at least one recent thread about siege warfare that talked about authority and some kind of system that sounded very similar to capture the flag/domination/capture and control the objective type things. and ppl not likely the ideas for various reasons, including what i said, plus some more, i think. IMO, i think capturing authority objects sounds cool, but shouldn't be a requirement to use siege engines (maybe build them, but it shoudlnt be useless becasue you move it out of the radius) i do know and accept the fact that my game time is limited, and the chances of me being taken seriously by vets are slim, but frankly...i dont give a shit

[Potjeh]

The territory capture thing works if one can't build a siege camp and crank out catapults in short time. Otherwise you might as well remove that requirement and just let people lug around finished siege weapons.

[calodine]

Having to use specific siege weapons for specific walls is stupid. A catapult already has an advantage over a battering ram - You get to stay at a distance and not worry so much about archers. A battering ram would probably be better against gates, and easier to make. Making proper stone walls limited to a king (Which is stupid in and of itself) is stupid. Its putting a stone on another stone repeated a few times. Last I checked some pointless crown wasn't required. Also last time I checked kings didn't go around handcrafting walls.