No permadeath - more action

[Potjeh]

Every description of H&H that I've seen includes open PvP and permadeath.

[Procne]

This one does not:
http://www.havenandhearth.com/portal/about

[DatOneGuy]

This one does not:
http://www.havenandhearth.com/portal/about

Stop reading that one then.

[Procne]

Yes sir. What else should I not read?

[DatOneGuy]

Yes sir. What else should I not read?

Well that stuff is really old, probably hasn't been updated since W3, they could do with a new mission statement.

The game was always intended (AFAIK) to have permadeath and open pvp though. Never heard it said otherwise by the devs.

Most of those things you see on 'Media', 'About' or anything on the 'main pages' hasn't been updated since early W3 or W2. Media pictures don't have anything W3-5. (I take that back jorb added his eating at a table and such from w3)

[bmjclark]

I guess I'm hijacking the thread now since it's not what OP meant, but I'll post it here instead of making new thread.

I like HnH because of it's sandbox aspect - building, improving, exploring. I was shocked at first by the permadeath feature when boar stabbed me to death taking all skills away. Thanks to Ender's client this problem is nomore. But now I have to deal with travelling griefers who murder anyone they see because they can. Sure, it is some fun for them, but for me it's game breaking :/. I am not interested in PvP and I seek to do no harm to anyone. I just want to be left alone.

So what I would propose is to make some non-PvP version of game account. Description of such account:
- No character on it can use criminal acts, not even to trespass.
- No character on such account can be murdered. (But their claim can still be trespassed and stolen from, and they still can be killed by animals, drown, etc.)
- No character can belong to any village (in case it would give village invulnerable workers)
- Account may not be transferred into normal account (to avoid people raising their stats safely and then going into PvP)
- LP ganing rate reduced by 50%

People may argue that game without PvP will quickly get boring and that PvP is the proper end-game / goal of the game. Well, for newbies who get murdered after a week or 2 of playing by some high level player, it will get boring even faster after having to start from scratch again and again. And HnH may still be very fun without this PvP aspect. So just let people, who like to build, build, and the ones who like to fight and grief - fight and grief among each other

Honestly, having a different kind of account that cant be murdered is just stupid. If anything it would have to be on a different server. This game is harsh and unforgiving, and it was built to be. Everyone in the game should be able to be murdered by the random griefer and they should have to fight to defend their property sometimes. If what you proposed went through, there would be a lot of cases and griefers (griefer isnt really the right term, i guess random murderers) going around and taking a swing at somebody and then as they are knocked out realise "Oh, shit cant murder him". Quite a few people like that would stop playing to be honest.

[burgingham]

Yes sir. What else should I not read?

Well that stuff is really old, probably hasn't been updated since W3, they could do with a new mission statement.)

Try world 1.

To Procne: I know this sounds a bit lame, but when you don't want permadeath then you have simply chosen the wrong game. It is the central aspect of hnh, or at least a necessary feature to ensure the game becomes the kind of simulation that it is.

[Procne]

It's not that I don't want permadeath specifically. Although I was against it when, to my surprise, some boar destroyed my character some time.

What I'd like to avoid is some high level players walking around and murdering all lowbies just because they can. They played for months and they could build their characters. And newbies are totally on their mercy now. If only there was a way to avoid it...
Death when boar / bear kills you - your fault.
Death when you drown or cave ceiling collapses on you - your fault.
Death when you are tracked after trespassing - your fault.
Death when your village is waging a war - fine.
Death when some bored guy decided to murder you - not your fault and you cannot do anything.

Exactly what kind of simulation this game is? Of what some people are willing to do to make others' game as miserable as possible? Of how paranoid people can become? Of how many people will steal and grief, and what ways they can invent to do so?

Let them steal and destroy if they have to, but don't make others have to start the game all over again

If what you proposed went through, there would be a lot of cases and griefers (griefer isnt really the right term, i guess random murderers) going around and taking a swing at somebody and then as they are knocked out realise "Oh, shit cant murder him". Quite a few people like that would stop playing to be honest.

I'm sure I'm as compasionate to those murderers as you are to the whiners like me. They would leave, others would stay. To me it's weird to promote such griefing and making people angry / hate each other. I wonder, how many people quit because of those murderers.
You may say that I'm raging because someone killed me. And that I can't get over it and this game isn't for me. But I'm pretty sure that if I murdered the very guy who killed me now, he would be even more infuriated. But it won't happen, since he's much stronger and can kill anyone he wants. So the game is for him, but not for me.

I mean, this game seems to generate lots of negative emotions. Forum is filled with stories about griefing, bug using and general unfriendliness.
It takes one person having small pleasure in griefing others, to have many griefed players getting very irritated by him.

[ysbryd]

Fact of life, there will always be someone bigger, stronger, more bad ass, worse attitude, different morals, more money, more power ad nauseum, than you... this game is about survival, and how you choose to do that is up to you. You can protect yourself in many ways, and if you need to, join a village. But the central theme as far as I can tell, in H n H is that adrenelin rush that is always there when you meet someone you are not sure of.. much as it would have been at the time... am I going to survive this encounter?

[Procne]

Another fact - game is not life. Why does everyone feel that game should have all the violence, hate and harshness of real world?