The Curiosity System and What Went Wrong

[sabinati]

how much time do you actually spend on getting curios YoukaiMori? from what you've said you seem to think it takes like 100% of one's game time just to acquire curios.

[YoukaiMori]

There was only one step, they were directly related to each other and rewarded based on the difficulty of the task. You couldn't perform a meaningful task without progressing. Yes. There were "easy ways out" to get LESS LP than the more difficult ways. Just like there are now, you can either just forage 50LP cone cows for a week, or you can produce 40,000 LP shit. But like I just said, meaningful actions and character progression are no longer linked they are separate.

You got shit LP for "meaningful tasks", the real juice was in doing stupid things that were done just to get LP, like hunting and deforestation. You didn't have to do these things, but you were progressing really fucking slowly if you didn't, to the point where other sources were almost negligible.

No, people didn't build houses for LP alone, that was never my argument. It was that while building the house you were steadily rewarded for each step, gathering the materials, building the house, and then on completion you have a house.

Personally, I don't care about being rewarded constantly, and I am fine with being patient for results.

How was hunting a stupid or meaningless task? You got a boatload of material that was used in just about everything a village or solo player could want. I had a buddy who enjoyed doing nothing but planting farms and making honey. He didn't use any of it, it was given to another person in the village who used it all, but that was the thing he enjoyed doing, just socializing, farming and honey. Even then, he made enough LP to pump up his skills several points each time he played. That was how he enjoyed playing and he progressed at a pace that was still fun for him to the point he played for months doing just that and still wanted to keep playing (Until the world change.). What is wrong with that? Gaining LP is not a race.

A more difficult action like hunting was rewarded more highly all at once than a simple action like harvesting crops or planting. As I've said before, I was a clothier and leather worker, I did almost entirely that and I kept up in LP with people who spent all day hunting for bears for those large LP spikes, and eventually I trained hunting skills as well to supplement my chosen crafts in down time. And no, I never crafted 1,000 of something and dropped it on the ground, everything went into use in the village or was sold to neighbors who couldn't produce things as high quality.

I'll say it again, you had a choice to play however you wanted and your own time and effort was the only limit on how quickly you could progress. Again, LP gain isn't a race. If you play the game as an LP race that's a whole different can of worms I won't even get into.

[YoukaiMori]

how much time do you actually spend on getting curios YoukaiMori? from what you've said you seem to think it takes like 100% of one's game time just to acquire curios.

Most of the time. Because when my study window is full and has six hours before the first thing is finished I get bored and log off. I've made it pretty clear that a six hour wait time is boring. It is a cap on how much fun you're allowed to have in a time period. If I don't have a cupboard full of curios to use after filling my study window, once those studies HAVE finished I need to drop what I'm doing to gather more.

[Ninijutsu]

you had a choice to play however you wanted and your own time and effort was the only limit on how quickly you could progress.

It's still like that.

And by hunting I meant just killing and leaving the carcasses for LP.

[DrakenRahl]

Is it just me or does this.->

how much time do you actually spend on getting curios YoukaiMori? from what you've said you seem to think it takes like 100% of one's game time just to acquire curios.

Most of the time. Because when my study window is full and has six hours before the first thing is finished I get bored and log off. I've made it pretty clear that a six hour wait time is boring. It is a cap on how much fun you're allowed to have in a time period. If I don't have a cupboard full of curios to use after filling my study window, once those studies HAVE finished I need to drop what I'm doing to gather more.

Sound like the exact opposite of this.->

Again, LP gain isn't a race. If you play the game as an LP race that's a whole different can of worms I won't even get into.

[YoukaiMori]

Is it just me or does this.->

how much time do you actually spend on getting curios YoukaiMori? from what you've said you seem to think it takes like 100% of one's game time just to acquire curios.

Most of the time. Because when my study window is full and has six hours before the first thing is finished I get bored and log off. I've made it pretty clear that a six hour wait time is boring. It is a cap on how much fun you're allowed to have in a time period. If I don't have a cupboard full of curios to use after filling my study window, once those studies HAVE finished I need to drop what I'm doing to gather more.

Sound like the exact opposite of this.->

Again, LP gain isn't a race. If you play the game as an LP race that's a whole different can of worms I won't even get into.

How so?

[petal]

I didn't read anything.

[Bugssy]

how much time do you actually spend on getting curios YoukaiMori? from what you've said you seem to think it takes like 100% of one's game time just to acquire curios.

Most of the time. Because when my study window is full and has six hours before the first thing is finished I get bored and log off. I've made it pretty clear that a six hour wait time is boring. It is a cap on how much fun you're allowed to have in a time period. If I don't have a cupboard full of curios to use after filling my study window, once those studies HAVE finished I need to drop what I'm doing to gather more.

BINGO, we have our answer, OP likes grinding for LP, clearly the curio system is boring to him/her as it is mostly passive (waiting on study time). Most HnH fans enjoy playing the rest of the game without having to grind for LP, but Op enjoys grinding. Not that there's anything wrong with that, if that's what you're into, but clearly the game has moved in a different direction, which has done away the one of the aspects that OP enjoyed the most, which explains the frustration.

Unfortunately but fortunately the grinding for LP system isn't coming back, OP should probably pursue other avenues for his grinding fix.

[GrapefruitV]

And exactly what was stopping you from using that bread dough for food? Absolutely nothing was stopping you from using it. You act like you weren't allowed to use it, that you were forced to destroy the bread dough.

I can get enough hunger for hundreds of loafs per day only with other exploits. As sabi pointed, it was useless for raising const, it was only to fill hunger bar, but why would I empty it for nothing in the first place?
Also I would need to bake it. And my village buddies already made teapots from all the clay around and buckets from all the trees. (please don't take the last one seriously, because I already understood you are special enough to take clay and tree thing as serious argument and pretend I did not say anything else)

I am farming, I don't want to grow pumpkins, so I don't. This is fine because I don't NEED pumpkins so I lose nothing, and use my farm space for other things that I do want.
I am farming, I don't want to grow curiosities, so I don't. I now can't advance my character. So I use my same space for curiosity industry, I now have a more limited farm/space for whatever that's taken up by this.

You are free to use only curiosities you get from specific activities, if you are not interested in LP race (your words). Pure farming gives you atleast 4 different curios. Add connected to farming baking and silkmaking and you have 7. Add trees cultivation and you have few more +possibility to exchange your wood for metal. Also keep in mind the game is not finished and I'm sure amount of curios will grow.
Before you will say anything else about bad dragonflies keeping you from fast development or being not able to choose your profession, check this out. Especially how to get and base lp columns. Because you clearly have no experience, even if you believe you do. Thats normal, I see that all the time, because I answer newbies questions everyday. Everyone, who reached palisade and 100 farming, thinks they are pro and know everything. I been there myself, world seems different, when you're a noob. My first char ever died from drowning, even though I knew "DON'T BUY SWIMMING" thing, because on my first day I thought 20 const is a lot. Her descendant died the next day being stabbed by neighbour's sword while making buckets to get what I've lost fast.

You were not forced to create "thousands of bread dough" for LP, nor were you forced to get rid of them once you made them. For all I care, you could make a thousand bread dough, bake the bread, and then eat it all at once like a fat ass. But you can not choose not to produce curiosities if you want to really play the game. You NEED to produce curiosities. You are forced into a specific industry to create these, or specific crafts to create higher quality ones.

Once again: you can have all the basic skills and slow development with curios you don't need to work hard for. Even without such obvious solution as trade. Like fishing? Study Eyeballs and floatsams. Like foraging? Edels, glimmermoss, bluebells, boletes, etc. Like hunting? Seers bones, teddybears, leather balls, teeth, etc. (and don't even try to pretend you need more than one bearcape for each of your chars or all the bones, palisade and idol take like 1cb both, and you will get a lot more) Like mining? Soldiers, horsies, crystals, etc. And so on.

I have been trying to explain this since post 1. You are forced into crafts you may not want to use in order to advance quicker, as opposed to having your source of LP be your own choice of anything.

You have been trying to explain since post 1 too many things already. But still fail to understand, that people don't accept your opinion not because they don't understand it.

I can not explain this any better, I honestly can not. You might say, "Well in normal MMO's you can only kill enemies for exp", this is a sandbox game and it didn't USED to be like this. That is why I am critiquing the system. H&H had a great concept and a great exp system that made every action fun, everything you did was fun because you were rewarded for it, and yes, players like rewards. Why do people grind in normal MMO's? The rewards. Be it items, exp, or gold. Getting LP for your actions, as small as it is might be, makes you feel like nothing is wasted. Getting nothing for most actions makes you feel like you're doing nothing important and it's not fun. WAITING isn't fun.

Exactly, this is a sandbox game. And you seem to be not able to understand this concept. Did you ever play in sandbox irl? It doesn't need experience system at all to be fun. LP is not your reward and never was. It always was only a tool to make your sand castle better. Joy from game process is your reward. Don't know how about you, but my sand castle consists of beautiful village building, social projects, market competition, industry race and tile art (because I past the line, when new objects discovery and getting new skills is fun, long ago). And all of this is more fun and rewarding with current system.

You also keep saying "YOU can reject bots", "YOU can reject buckets", "YOU can eat your bread. Yes, I can. Not sure if I will though, if buckets would give me more lp, than fun activities. But this is not about me or you. All the game design solutions should be oriented on the worst in moral scale and strongest nolifer, not on average noob. To make this game playable for others devs have to keep in mind image of superstrong bug abuser and exploiter with unlimited amounts of free time, not some random guy, who doesn't want to destroy forest because it is not fun or wrong.

[Kaios]

Is it just me or does this.->

how much time do you actually spend on getting curios YoukaiMori? from what you've said you seem to think it takes like 100% of one's game time just to acquire curios.

Most of the time. Because when my study window is full and has six hours before the first thing is finished I get bored and log off. I've made it pretty clear that a six hour wait time is boring. It is a cap on how much fun you're allowed to have in a time period. If I don't have a cupboard full of curios to use after filling my study window, once those studies HAVE finished I need to drop what I'm doing to gather more.

Sound like the exact opposite of this.->

Again, LP gain isn't a race. If you play the game as an LP race that's a whole different can of worms I won't even get into.

Nope, not just you. Those two points contradict each other in my opinion as well.

>Claims there's no race when gaining LP
>Drops everything he's doing non-LP related when curios run out to gather more.

Dude, all it takes is one or two hours a day at the most once you've reached a certain point in your per*exp to find what I would consider to be enough curiosities to last you at least the day. At which point everything else you do is up to you. Not anyone else's fault if you're mad because you can't grind and improve upon your village and/or industry at the same time.