Another metal source

Thoughts on the further development of Haven & Hearth? Feel free to opine!

Another metal source

Postby dcastello79 » Sun Mar 21, 2010 11:36 pm

Before you begin flamming and destroying this earnest topic, please at least give me a slight benefit of the doubt and actually read my topic.


A major problem with this game is the lack of available metal for players who either do not own a mine, are not in a large, powerful guild, or both. While technically this shouldn't really be a problem in the sense that the 'market' will work itself out to deliver metal, at higher prices, to those who need it. This would be nice if there was a market...but with the new reset, villages are spread-out, and largely logistically hard to locate..etc. etc. Thus, many players are left without even small amounts of metal, and no I'm not saying that players need metal armor or metal weapons, but what about things like frying pans and other such essentials?

An alternative:

I saw an extraordinarily helpful solution to the problem of metal scarcity. The program, in short, explained how the ancient vikings, a group of people who inhabited Scandinavia, procured metals from their mine-less environment: they got their metal from gathering particles of metal which had been swept away by the mountain rivers into the nearby plains in which the metals settled. So, the vikings would collect these particles and then they would undergo a very long, complex process of smelted clumps of collected metal particles together to form workable pieces of metal.

If the developers were to incorporate something like this, they could have very small amounts of metal spread out along the lands immediately located near mountains where players can dig in the ground, like clay, to find them. Then, the developers could introduce another diversion of the metal smelting process to enable players to make small particles of metal into workable clumps of metal, which would eventually become the same as metal found in mines. The thing which would balance this method is that it would be: 1) hard to locate and dig-up these metal particles 2) tedious to procure accumulations of these hard-to-find metals, which would thus allow players without mines to get metal without receiving an advantage over players who already have mines...in fact, the latter group would have an advantage still over the former.


Idk...it's just an idea. If you have read this far, I thank you, and I won't mind if you relentlessly destroy my idea. I'm fully aware that there isn't much I could say or do from keeping people from acting in their natural manners. :lol:
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Re: Another metal source

Postby ImpalerWrG » Mon Mar 22, 2010 12:11 am

Sounds like a reasonable way to allow surface placer mining, traditionally this is how mines were actually located by following placer deposits in rivers up the the parent rock though I don't really see a need to link real mines and placer deposits in this way. I could see this working but it would need to be a small probability of getting a nugget when you dig in the river bank so its not easy to find or easy to extract and should run out in reasonable time frame say ~50 nuggets for gold deposit, perhaps more for other metals. A popular bog-iron suggestion would work in much the same way.
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Re: Another metal source

Postby DeadlyPencil » Mon Mar 22, 2010 12:11 am

i dont like that idea, getting iron ore from a bog with stick is a better suggestion. also panning for gold was already suggested
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Re: Another metal source

Postby theTrav » Mon Mar 22, 2010 1:20 am

Both panning and Bog iron was spoken about a fair while ago, the dev's seemed to think both were reasonable ideas but have yet to implement them.
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Re: Another metal source

Postby Naerymdan » Mon Mar 22, 2010 3:25 pm

Just having a random chance (1%) of getting a low-yield ore from digging in soil or river bank or chipping stones from a boulder would be great.

Imagine: You are doing whatever you usually do, for example gathering clay. Woah! You got a copper ore! Oh boy, oh boy, oh boy! You bake yourself 45 bricks, get a smelter and..... get a stone. Better luck next time.

This would be a HORRIBLE alternative to mines but... at least this would give a chance of actually having some metal to mine-less players. For key-copying, for making wooden chests, cellars.
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Re: Another metal source

Postby Gauteamus » Mon Mar 22, 2010 4:11 pm

Naerymdan wrote:Just having a random chance (1%) of getting a low-yield ore from digging in soil or river bank or chipping stones from a boulder would be great.

Imagine: You are doing whatever you usually do, for example gathering clay. Woah! You got a copper ore! Oh boy, oh boy, oh boy! You bake yourself 45 bricks, get a smelter and..... get a stone. Better luck next time.

This would be a HORRIBLE alternative to mines but... at least this would give a chance of actually having some metal to mine-less players. For key-copying, for making wooden chests, cellars.


I think this sounds like a reasonable stand-in, using existing mechanics (and possibly even existing code) until a bog-iron regime is eventually worked out.
how unbalancing can it be to find a random ore neutrally industry mined with some lowish random chance?
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Re: Another metal source

Postby ImpalerWrG » Mon Mar 22, 2010 7:44 pm

Naerymdan wrote:Just having a random chance (1%) of getting a low-yield ore from digging in soil or river bank or chipping stones from a boulder would be great.

Imagine: You are doing whatever you usually do, for example gathering clay. Woah! You got a copper ore! Oh boy, oh boy, oh boy! You bake yourself 45 bricks, get a smelter and..... get a stone. Better luck next time.

This would be a HORRIBLE alternative to mines but... at least this would give a chance of actually having some metal to mine-less players. For key-copying, for making wooden chests, cellars.


That's why the player should get a nugget of metal rather then ore
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Re: Another metal source

Postby sabinati » Mon Mar 22, 2010 7:51 pm

it should probably be a flake or something rather than a nugget
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Re: Another metal source

Postby Naerymdan » Mon Mar 22, 2010 8:22 pm

Don't get carried away now :)

Alternative metal source shouldn't be a competition to real mines.... but if one has to get lucky 10 times and get 10 flakes (of the same ore at that) to then make a nugget... That might be pushing things a bit far.

Getting Q10 nuggets instead of ore seems a good alternative to me:

- Low chance of getting one
- No need for full smelting equipment
- Direct or almost direct usability for minor things
- Non-competitive with mines
- Still requires much effort / little trade to get a full bar for cellar
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Re: Another metal source

Postby sabinati » Mon Mar 22, 2010 8:57 pm

i'd like to see bogs improved a bit with the ability to dig peat, some chance of a bog ore (smelts into iron nugget, x% chance, not dependent on nature/industry) when you dig. there should also be berry spawns on bog. edit: change of getting bog ore should probably depend on a quality point

maybe a 1% chance of a piece of ore when you chip stone?

panning for other metals should yield flakes of type and quality dependent on the map q points and possibly proximity to a mine of that type. silver and gold obviously wouldn't have q. mix (3? 5? 10? idk) the flakes together in alloying crucible to get a nugget.
Last edited by sabinati on Mon Mar 22, 2010 9:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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