Game Development: Steelmaking, and stuff.

[Ken]

Okay... I need to apologize a bit for my last post. I was a bit too tired and emotionally charged to be saying anything. Let's see if I can condense it to something more constructive...

I mostly like what you're doing with the game, I just don't necessarily agree with the order, your priorities, but it's your game and your prerogative. You're making what you want and I deeply respect that. The only reason I've been so upset by certain changes that get in the way for the time being and the only reason I've taken them so seriously is because I've enjoyed the game so much... take that as you will, preferably as a compliment.

Part of what bugged me about making skills so much heavier is the fact that Haven & Hearth really isn't like other games--the reason I got hooked in the first place is because it wasn't about grinding to EARN the skills, it was about emergent gameplay--USING those skills in a dynamic, open world, a sandbox full of other players, to create settlements, towns, relationships, whatever may happen. It just seems like the recent update has, in some cases, gone against this, shifting the focus back towards drawn-out grinding and funneling players into certain, limited play types.

[quote="Dennislp3"]My point is that I noticed it seemed like it has started to become a bit of "everyone freaks cause we feel this is gonna stay forever" type situation. All we need to do is step back, take a deep breath, act mature, and constructively help Jorb and Loftar make this the game it is going to be.[/quote]

Even if it has been done in what some call an "immature" manner, this is exactly what people have been doing--helping the developers make the game. If so many people take issue with how something was handled, chances are something was done wrong. I think we all want the game to be the best it can be, and it takes both compliments and criticism when necessary to move things in the best direction. I don't think anyone assumes things are going to stay one way forever, which is why they're trying to push things in what they think is the right direction by posting here.

EDIT: Hm... I made sure my BBcode was set to default-on, but I can't get it to work in the post, sorry...

[Dennislp3]

Im aware of that...I was just making a point that maturity is a major part of all this too...notice how i didnt say "stop acting immature" or anything that pointed fingers...so its all good I mean no harm I come in peace lol

[Ken]

Oh, goodness, I know! I'm not trying to attack you. Just pointing out that everyone really is trying to help.

[loftar]

Part of what bugged me about making skills so much heavier is the fact that Haven & Hearth really isn't like other games--the reason I got hooked in the first place is because it wasn't about grinding to EARN the skills, it was about emergent gameplay--USING those skills in a dynamic, open world, a sandbox full of other players, to create settlements, towns, relationships, whatever may happen. It just seems like the recent update has, in some cases, gone against this, shifting the focus back towards drawn-out grinding and funneling players into certain, limited play types.

Interesting comment. To a large extent, I agree. It has always been my intention to make Haven a game that can be played casually.

Of course, it also needs to be contrasted with a number of other issues, though. First of all, I do think that it was far too easy to make log cabins previously; it wasn't even a challenge. Of course, we did increase the requirements with more than an order of magnitude, though, but then again, it will be helped by future stuff as well. First of all, we seek to make trees replantable, of course, which will make it a lot easier to get hold of the 18 trees required to make a log cabin. We also want to implement wagons for transportation of stuff, including logs, which will make it easier to gather the trees. Also, if you do, indeed, settle among other players, it is not unlikely that you might be able to take advantage of existing economy in the area as well; and speaking of that, we also intend to implement some features to encourage such things. Even casual players can set up a log cabin; it just takes more time and more "sessions" of play.

Likewise with the iron making, I think. It sounds draconian at first, but all you really need to do is log in a couple of minutes every twelfth hour. Some people may have problems with that in their schedules of course, but it's not actually a lot of work in itself. And again, steel is only required for pretty high-level stuff right now.

It's uncertain what it really will entail, for sure. I, for one, sure hope that we don't make the game too demanding. We will, most likely, have to change a lot of these things any way for many other reasons as well, so don't think for a second that they are set in stone. You may very well log in the next day and see the entire ruleset of the game having been changed again. ;)

[Cpowa]

This update is good for realism, but now it's a nolife game =/

[Blaze]

I started making steel yesterday, only 2 more days to go :/. I'll go ahead and say 56 hours seems excessive. Could you at least boost the crucible capacity to 6?

Also, does having industry personality bonuses affect the chance of getting Bloom and successfully changing bloom into wrought iron?

[theTrav]

[quote="Cpowa"]This update is good for realism, but now it's a nolife game =/[/quote]

Perhaps having your own house and being kitted out in a soldiers sword & helm + steel plate is, but there's still plenty of stuff you can do without that.

Alternatively you could call it a game you play socially and accrue big ticket items over the course of a month or two.

Primarily I think we should all play for a week before we pass judgment, all we're doing now is speculating

[dekafu]

Mind if I ask definitively whether the required materials for log cabins will be lowered at any point within the next few weeks? I'm still determined to get one, but now I'm paranoid about getting burned again. I get the impression it won't, but I don't want to spend hours building one now if there's the slightest chance it'll suddenly become cheaper the moment I'm finished.

It seems I can't stay away from this game, despite all the heartbreak. :P

[kimya]

Yeah, now that i have two iron slownly becoming steel, i realised its not the real big deal. sure it takes some time, but not a lot more than before, until you have an iron. steal is quite a challenge, though. but fortunately theres a 1:1 conversion rate for iron/steel. otherwise i'd scream and run, realising that after 56h of waiting, theres nothing left in the crucible...

[RaptorJedi]

Are there any plans to make slag useful? Like melting it back down into iron?