The Ghost of Christmas Future

[Bob_the_Cat]

People on the forums really only post to argue over pointless junk...

But for the longbow / crossbow argument, nothing would be more annoying then being 1 shot through ur armor by a stupid guy with a crossbow while u were looking away for 10 seconds. And theres only so many game mechanics about bows in this game, so theres not much you can do to make it balanced. Making a crossbow a extra slow, but more powerful weapon would be wicked op, and if it aimed extra fast and was low damage a really high q one could still snipe a skiller over his wall while hes running to his house... Theres no room in this game for a crossbow, unless he changes a game mechanic in hafen.

Also, crossbows feel much to high tech for haven times. haven tech should be primative.

[Lord_of_War]

We sure do but its fascinating and we are all being enlightened so I rather like it. You can take that argument to any level too proving that everything is pointless, but I wont get too far semantic. Post count is meaningless, Im here for the interesting discussions. And thank you for the information, its fascinating and I will be going through it.

[wonder-ass]

if hafen uses same mechanics as haven crossbows should be a cool thing it would be fun for high and skilled archers to use you would need alot of marksmanship for it to actually aim
so it would not be overpowered look at it like it is a higher tier then the ranger bow so you would need more mm to actually shoot it or even aim
and if it had a reload time so its not to overpowered of a weapon insta shooting
too high tech there is a meet grinder in haven you think they had meet grinders in the days ?

[Vaku]

you think they had meet grinders in the days ?

Lots of things in HnH can be anachronistic, but meat grinders are technically not one of them.

Meats were certainly ground up for some recipes. Check out the De Re Coquinaria, or by its other name, Apicius.

[Cajoes]

I hope it doesn't have the same game-play as Salem because i didn't like how Salem is just the same thing for like 3 months. Grinding and grinding. I think HnH v2 shouldn't be free and should be on Steam. It'll help support Seatribe add even more content and get a better paycheck. But even though it isn't free the original HnH is free. Just an idea tho

Firstly: If I am reading it correctly, there won't be a "HnH Classic", and secondly. Just because everyone is putting their unfinished games on Steam's Greenlight service, doesn't mean that everyone should.

And I'll take discussions like this over a hundred topics in Congress.

I think the biggest factors that made the relatively more complicated crossbow more popular than the longer ranged knight kabobing device of English Longbows was twofold, as was mentioned prior, the depletion of suitable yew trees and the fact that to get a good longbow-man, able to string and draw those obscenely impressive longbows, you started training him at 7 years old. To get a good crossbow-man, you found a peasant and gave him a crossbow. Maybe ordering him to practice hitting things with it if you're feeling fru-fru. Point I'm painfully forcing out of my verbal diatribe is that with sufficient industry its easier to mass produce complex devices, than it is to mass produce knight-skewering badasses. (At least until we discover cloning).

That said, crossbows are not alien technology. Vikings used the dang things. (Or rather, the Irish used them to fend off the Vikings, but semantics.) The only real development of the crossbow through the ages is the amount of force they could store up for the projectile. This neatly ties into my next point.

Crossbows in this era, were kinda ass.

It's a physics thing, a crossbow is just a very tiny bow, loosing (firing projectiles is a jargon for firearms) a tiny arrow, with ludicrous amounts of force. The draw strength of a crossbow is actually much smaller, meaning a lot less energy goes into the far lighter projectile, meaning to compensate, you have to pack much more energy into it. Whereas the longbow, in particular yew bows, managed a similar, if not far better penetration, by using a larger projectile that could impact with more force, while utilizing the energy of the archer far more effectively with its draw strength. While it's true that crossbows became better later on, heavy crossbows, capable of punching straight through a knight, his mount, and both their sets of armor, wasn't really widely available until the 15th century. A far cry from the ubiquitous ??? to 9th century Haven evokes.

I don't understand the argument regarding game balance, whats to stop one from popping that hypothetical low health skiller using a sling instead? ... and what the deuce is a skiller. He can't be that skilled if he has to hide in a cabin.

If only we could somehow defend from hails of arrows, quarrels and stones using some specialized piece of armor, maybe wielded in the off-hand, made from various materials including leather and wood, or metal rim to reinforce it for melee encounters. A sort of shield if you will...

Seriously, why don't shields work for arrows and stones. That's the sole reason people even carried the damn things into battle at all.


That said, our dear raging forebears were not primitive. They were excellent navigators, traders, smiths, warriors and damn fine carpenters too, they simply had the wonderful idea that if someone else s shit is better than yours, you take it. Following in the burning wake of the Roman Empire's entire foreign policy. (Or you trade for it. Trading's cool too.)

Also, +Ulfberh+t

TL;DR: Start from the top, you'll get it eventually.

[Bob_the_Cat]

so it would not be overpowered look at it like it is a higher tier then the ranger bow so you would need more mm to actually shoot it or even aim
and if it had a reload time so its not to overpowered of a weapon insta shooting
too high tech there is a meet grinder in haven you think they had meet grinders in the days ?[/quote]

There is always going to be those troll village guys with 900 mm that will just snipe you with it though. And if it was better then a rangers bow, if they happen to hit you with it no armor will save you. A Q150 rangers bow can already do insane damage. If the crossbow was high enough q for someone to use their 900 mm it would be able to 1 hit bear.

And technically, a crossbow is extremely easy to aim, once its wound. So making the crossbow strong and take ages to aim doesn't really make sense. But if you made it so once winding for ages, you can aim in like 5 secs it would be the most op thing ever.

[Potjeh]

We have plate armour, which sets the period at 13th century at the earliest

Also, crossbow bolts are typically heavier than arrows.

[Lord_of_War]

We have plate armour, which sets the period at 13th century at the earliest

Also, crossbow bolts are typically heavier than arrows.

Not so. The Romans had plate armor. Granted the tradition was lost but we can't rule out the possibility. http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lorica_segmentata

[Potjeh]

That's not plate.

Also, going by minor items, monocles and top hats set the date to 18th centurey at the earliest

[Lord_of_War]

.

That's not plate.

Also, going by minor items, monocles and top hats set the date to 18th centurey at the earliest

That's better than plate. All the advantages of it and mobility. History is weird it could have happened. I certainly don't want them removed. But a in game roman armor would be so awesome.