Keeping you Posted, #0

[Potjeh]

Well, it had the basic skeleton, but zero meat on it. And the scale was completely off. So yeah, I wouldn't call it developed.

[Ninijutsu]

I have also considered something like having a very large map, with a few different, rather small, areas for wilderness spawns, separated from each other.

A larger map would significantly aid in solving one of Haven's largest problems: griefing. New players, no matter how much they love playing Haven, will almost always quit after being harassed by higher level players. A large map would encourage diplomacy within regional communities, and discourage mindless pillaging from bored players with sledgehammers (though I don't know if you'll be changing siege, which could remedy this situation).

Also, I dream of a Haven with oceans and semi-permanently inhabitable ships. Just wanna put that out there

[Lunarius_Haberdash]

I have also considered something like having a very large map, with a few different, rather small, areas for wilderness spawns, separated from each other.

A larger map would significantly aid in solving one of Haven's largest problems: griefing. New players, no matter how much they love playing Haven, will almost always quit after being harassed by higher level players. A large map would encourage diplomacy within regional communities, and discourage mindless pillaging from bored players with sledgehammers (though I don't know if you'll be changing siege, which could remedy this situation).

Also, I dream of a Haven with oceans and semi-permanently inhabitable ships. Just wanna put that out there

Frankly I like the wild nature of spawning we have now, with the ability to spawn near your friends. I miss the old Charter Stones that allowed us to create those areas you're talking about Loftar, they were the backbone of my villages when we had them, and I was deeply disappointed by their removal. Let us establish those small spawning areas, there are those of us that will. Otherwise, let the random number gods drop us somewhere, anywhere, in the world. Though there isn't anything inherently wrong with what you've suggested, except that I suspect someone would figure out where those are and start hunting newbs there.

Ninjitusu has a solid point though, and some may say they don't have the fortitude for this kind of game. There's some truth to that, I'll admit. There are two things that we need to help develop regional communities and identities, and one of those is a map large enough for us to stretch our legs. The other is the removal of teleportation so where we land, is where we are. I think baby blue eyes should be the sole exception to this, with the ability to 'Wake to Another Dream' a few times during it's duration to find a place to stretch your legs. (IE - Let you randomly teleport somewhere else). Leaving scents, building a permanent structure of any kind, and a few other things should invalidate "Baby Blue" with a warning.

[Lunarius_Haberdash]

I'm really split over this. On the one hand, I don't really like how one can just mindlessly walk in one direction and 'vacuum the map" and just teleport back*. On the other hand, Salem has shown that "the way back" isn't a very fun journey to undertake. As it stands right now, we'll probably keep teleport-back-to-hearth as it is.
* Arguably, this is related to the penetrability of the map mentioned above

This was always the point to me, "The Way Back". The ability to forage in an infinite range without considering the necessity to return home creates a few factors that are a problem.

1 - You can't get lost, getting lost should be a thing.
2 - Time spent foraging should include considerations of a return home, and a return home 'with your riches'.
3 - This is also used as a combat escape mechanism, also unacceptable (Even if I've used it myself). What creates 'locality' is needing to think about how far you can go out, and how quickly you can return home after doing so. Nothing else will make distance matter.
4 - It is also used heavily as a mechanic for raiders, also a problem. They will travel for days and hours looking for a sweet spot to hit, and then just 'pop' home. So now they've worked to get all that distance, and just vanished with the riches. There is no hope of 'I was just raided, minutes ago! They must still be nearby!". Nope, they're on the opposite side of the world from you. *THIS* is bullshit. They should have to be vulnerable in the wild if they've traveled to far from 'home base', they shouldn't get a free pass just by getting out of range.

This same thing creates the ability to truly police an area of criminals. If you find a nest of a raider, and can cut them out of their hole, you can run them out of your region. If 'their region' is 8+ hours of solid travel away from you, and they can get back their in an instant? They could be anywhere, and that puts the advantage solidly in their court.

A lot of elements of gameplay are affected by the ability to return home, not just trading and foraging. Removing teleportation (or severely limiting it) changes the whole flavor of how things function.

Add in that if you create 'regional resources', areas where Tin spawns far more often than Copper, or Iron. Regions where certain crops will not grow, but others will. Where certain animals spawn, and others don't. Then you NEED teleportation to be removed to keep things relevant, otherwise people will just alt all over the place again, and use these alts to teleport around the map and bypass trade, just like they do now.

Distance... We need space... and teleportation removes the relevance of space.


Trade is another topic that deserves attention... But mostly in the sense of "We should always have SOMETHING that is of value to trade", regional resources is a step in that direction. As it sits, you can get on top of the world and need nothing from anyone, and that is a problem. (It's even pretty trivial to reach)

[longfeather]

Am I the only one to be curious over the fact that some of the ore in the smelter is already smelted and some is not? >,>

[overtyped]

3 - This is also used as a combat escape mechanism, also unacceptable (Even if I've used it myself). What creates 'locality' is needing to think about how far you can go out, and how quickly you can return home after doing so. Nothing else will make distance matter.

Easy fix: make hearthing take 30 seconds, and make it take 30 seconds to log out as well.

Make it so you can't move aggro or be aggroed 20 seconds after logging into a character, but make logging out while in this state instant. This would help with raiders camping, and gives you time to get away/log out when there's people camping your hf waiting for you to log in.
These changes wouldn't hurt the game in any way, can I get a +1 plox?

[Lunarius_Haberdash]

3 - This is also used as a combat escape mechanism, also unacceptable (Even if I've used it myself). What creates 'locality' is needing to think about how far you can go out, and how quickly you can return home after doing so. Nothing else will make distance matter.

Easy fix: make hearthing take 30 seconds, and make it take 30 seconds to log out as well.

Make it so you can't move aggro or be aggroed 20 seconds after logging into a character, but make logging out while in this state instant. This would help with raiders camping, and gives you time to get away/log out when there's people camping your hf waiting for you to log in.
These changes wouldn't hurt the game in any way, can I get a +1 plox?

You completely miss the point, the fact that you can teleport home over infinite distances *AT ALL* is the problem. Not all violence and acts of aggression are upon a person.

And it still invalidates distance as an issue for the raider. Once they've got to you, it's an instant jump home. This still eliminates the sense of 'home' and 'locality' I'm speaking of.

Also, teleportation hurts the game, IMO. It invalidates the distances we have to travel, eliminates a sense of locality, removes any difficulty involved in trading safely, etc. What's the point of a large map if there's little need to cross it?

Also, this whole thing enhances the speed at which a place can be cleaned out.. You bring in a group of people with Large Chests, fill them up, hearth home, return, wash, rinse, repeat until the place is empty. You have no risk of being caught on your way home with ill-gotten gain. None of this is acceptable.

[overtyped]

3 - This is also used as a combat escape mechanism, also unacceptable (Even if I've used it myself). What creates 'locality' is needing to think about how far you can go out, and how quickly you can return home after doing so. Nothing else will make distance matter.

Easy fix: make hearthing take 30 seconds, and make it take 30 seconds to log out as well.

Make it so you can't move aggro or be aggroed 20 seconds after logging into a character, but make logging out while in this state instant. This would help with raiders camping, and gives you time to get away/log out when there's people camping your hf waiting for you to log in.
These changes wouldn't hurt the game in any way, can I get a +1 plox?

You completely miss the point, the fact that you can teleport home over infinite distances *AT ALL* is the problem. Not all violence and acts of aggression are upon a person.

And it still invalidates distance as an issue for the raider. Once they've got to you, it's an instant jump home. This still eliminates the sense of 'home' and 'locality' I'm speaking of.


Also, teleportation hurts the game, IMO. It invalidates the distances we have to travel, eliminates a sense of locality, removes any difficulty involved in trading safely, etc. What's the point of a large map if there's little need to cross it?

Also, this whole thing enhances the speed at which a place can be cleaned out.. You bring in a group of people with Large Chests, fill them up, hearth home, return, wash, rinse, repeat until the place is empty. You have no risk of being caught on your way home with ill-gotten gain. None of this is acceptable.

It isn't instant, it still takes 3 seconds to hearth as it is now, making it quite easy to stay in combat with an enemy.
As to the locality statement, i can understand the sentiment.
Crossroads may be gotten rid of, but removing hearthing home.. I don't think many people would like that.

[Lunarius_Haberdash]

It isn't instant, it still takes 3 seconds to hearth as it is now, making it quite easy to stay in combat with an enemy.
As to the locality statement, i can understand the sentiment.
Crossroads may be gotten rid of, but removing hearthing home.. I don't think many people would like that.

If you think that isn't instant, or that 30 seconds isn't instant, when you're crossing *3 supergrids*, I don't know how we can have this conversation. It has nothing to do with while you're directly being attacked. Well, that is relevant as well, but not the core of my point.

At no point should you be able to return instantly across that vast a distance.. Period.. Ever... You could literally hearth from one end of the map to the other. This is just plain unacceptable in a game that wishes to encourage regions, civilizations, trade, and the like. It may encourage trade, but only in that it becomes far too easy to engage in.

Combine it with regional resources, and no teleportation? Overland/Water trade becomes a necessity.

[loftar]

At no point should you be able to return instantly across that vast a distance.. Period.. Ever... You could literally hearth from one end of the map to the other. This is just plain unacceptable in a game that wishes to encourage regions, civilizations, trade, and the like. It may encourage trade, but only in that it becomes far too easy to engage in.

I'm not going to say that you don't have a point, but you are exaggerating it. If fast-travel is only possible in one direction, distance still matters.