Game Development: Bling & Beer Brawl

[Hamel]

what are you guys fighting for? this isnt some kind of caveman tribe where you can fight for superiority and become the alpha male.

There's an easier way to do that, even. It involves big clubs and bonking people on the head while grunting.

[Devour]

such a gay flamefest these days.

what are you guys fighting for? this isnt some kind of caveman tribe where you can fight for superiority and become the alpha male.

Man, the game is called Caves & Calfs.

[Voideka]

@Voideka - Sandbox means you change change the world. Not that you can do whatever you want without conseqences.

I don't usually argue about semantics but this is about the base essence of the game. A sandbox doesn't need to involve changing the world (it can, but it doesn't have to be), for example GTA4 and Prototype are both sandbox games. A sandbox game is something you can play however you want, within the confines of the game. So in Prototype for example, you can run around killing civvies, you can run around killing infected, or you can just ignore anything you don't need to kill. But when the game penalizes you heavily for doing something in a way that was not intended, it's not really a sandbox. That's like saying your game provides an infinitely large map but then surrounding the main area with impassable mountains.

If you'd like to learn more, there's a fantastic article about sandbox games here http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_i ... tory=18545 , and of course there are some straight definitions at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nonlinear_gameplay and http://www.game.co.uk/lowdown.aspx?lid=7771 .

[Devour]

I don't usually argue about semantics but this is about the base essence of the game. A sandbox doesn't need to involve changing the world (it can, but it doesn't have to be), for example GTA4 and Prototype are both sandbox games. A sandbox game is something you can play however you want, within the confines of the game. So in Prototype for example, you can run around killing civvies, you can run around killing infected, or you can just ignore anything you don't need to kill. But when the game penalizes you heavily for doing something in a way that was not intended, it's not really a sandbox. That's like saying your game provides an infinitely large map but then surrounding the main area with impassable mountains.

If you'd like to learn more, there's a fantastic article about sandbox games here http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_i ... tory=18545 , and of course there are some straight definitions at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nonlinear_gameplay and http://www.game.co.uk/lowdown.aspx?lid=7771 .

MMO Sandbox =/= Normal Game Sandbox

They are differents. Otherwise, every MMO would be a sandbox. And that would be NAUGHTY.

[theTrav]

A sandbox game is something you can play however you want, within the confines of the game.

While I tend to agree with the sentiment, the problem with that statement is that "the confines of the game" seems to be directly opposed to "play however you want"

Which is why I tend to fall back on the good old "non linear" or "not goal driven" definitions.

I actually looked up sandbox a while back and found a definition that sat far better with me which was that a "sandbox" is a mode within a game where you are not constrained by the normal restrictions like lack of time or resources or other mechanical constraints on realizing your vision. Kind of like playing transport tycoon with infinite money and the ability to do whatever you like to towns and opponents.

That's certainly not the sort of game H&H seems to be shaping up as, and with the way the advice for new players go (always get pottery, do these tasks, then get farming then do these tasks etc) it seems to be a bit more linear than I'd have liked, despite the lack of game enforced plot/quests.

Really I think the term sandbox has changed quite a bit since it was first coined, so any semantic argument that tries to pin down an exact argument is going to have difficulty.

[Jackard]

MMO Sandbox =/= Normal Game Sandbox

"im not actually wrong, im just using my own definition of the word"

[Voideka]

A sandbox game is something you can play however you want, within the confines of the game.

While I tend to agree with the sentiment, the problem with that statement is that "the confines of the game" seems to be directly opposed to "play however you want"

Which is why I tend to fall back on the good old "non linear" or "not goal driven" definitions.

I actually looked up sandbox a while back and found a definition that sat far better with me which was that a "sandbox" is a mode within a game where you are not constrained by the normal restrictions like lack of time or resources or other mechanical constraints on realizing your vision. Kind of like playing transport tycoon with infinite money and the ability to do whatever you like to towns and opponents.

That's certainly not the sort of game H&H seems to be shaping up as, and with the way the advice for new players go (always get pottery, do these tasks, then get farming then do these tasks etc) it seems to be a bit more linear than I'd have liked, despite the lack of game enforced plot/quests.

Really I think the term sandbox has changed quite a bit since it was first coined, so any semantic argument that tries to pin down an exact argument is going to have difficulty.

Well to be fair, no game is going to be infinite, therefor there are always constraints. There is no jousting in GTA4, by the by, but that doesn't stop it being a sandbox.

The part about the linearity however, is exactly what I mean. I hear QL is getting changed somehow, but let's keep it as an example. If I want to see item quality, I have to raise per, which means that I'd need to abandon my style of play in order to spike it up. If I don't spike it, I will be crippled by not knowing QLs. This forces linearity, which is not very sandboxy.

[NaoWhut]

WTF DOES THIS HAVE TO DO WITH
BEER AND THE OUTRAGEOUS CHANGE
TO QUALITY VIEW!? And why aren't
crying about no boats this time around?

[CG62]

WTF DOES THIS HAVE TO DO WITH BEER AND THE OUTRAGEOUS CHANGE TO QUALITY VIEW!?

^This.

Whatever happened to that guideline for the forums that went something like, "This is not a drama llama petting zoo"?



It's a sandbox game. It's a slightly more linear than normal sandbox, but you literally have NO predefined goals. You can set your own goals, but there are none set by the game. There's no "Reach Level X to win", or "Own 500k [item]".


Now, how about we douse these smoldering flames and get back to the discussion?

[NaoWhut]

Or we can go totally off topic again
and get mad at me for trying to bring
you back

Anyway, how bout them Rats eh?
rat stew? or chickens? making
cocktails?

Or hey! even the original topic? I got
to a glass too much today ^^ i luv 2
be drunk in this game J&L though
the perception killer is a pain.