For or against feminism(Plus exclusive Flame comic)

[overtyped]

I read an article about feminism, which is below this line. I just thought it would be good to have a discussion if you agree or disagree with it. I agree with it myself.
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Like any other socially conscious woman, I am a firm believer in gender equality. Ending workplace discrimination, making reproductive health care affordable—I’ve championed these goals my whole life. They’re important to me, and that’s why the feminist movement frustrates me so much. I’m sorry, but I simply cannot and will not support feminism if it means murdering all men.

I understand why some people might believe the only way to advance women’s rights is to slaughter every man on the planet, but that sort of radical, explicitly homicidal position, which for all I know is a fundamental aspect of feminism, is exactly what makes me hesitate to call myself a feminist.

Do I agree with closing the pay gap, ensuring universal access to birth control, and ending the objectification of women? Absolutely, and if that’s all feminism were about, I would get on board without any hesitation. Assuming feminists start advocating that we hunt down all the world’s men and boys, load them onto trains bound for death camps, and systematically massacre them solely on the basis of their sex, then that’s where I draw the line.

Of course, I don’t deny there are some misogynists out there whose behavior needs to be stopped. But I can’t help but think there has to be a better way to nurture the cause of social justice than, conceivably, having feminists instruct women to obtain assault weapons and drive to the nearest populated area so they can begin gunning down every human male they see.

Am I alone in thinking that would be an overreaction?

Consider the men in your own life. How would you feel if they were murdered? I have a loving father, two brothers, and a wonderful fiancé, not to mention countless male friends—each of whom I know for a fact respects women. I don’t want to kill them with my bare hands! I don’t care how noble the goals of the feminist movement are; should joining that cause require me to strangle every man I care about until the life slowly drains from his body, I just don’t want to be a part of it.

And just to be perfectly clear, we’re not talking about eliminating a few specific men on a case-by-case basis; we’re talking about the annihilation of roughly half the human population, presumably! To be sure, there are probably thousands of women-haters in the world who deserve to be locked up, but what feminists may be contemplating here is a program that would condemn approximately 3.6 billion people to immediate and extremely gruesome deaths just for being male, and that, to me at least, is going too far. Even if they were to do it painlessly by gassing or poisoning all the men, in my opinion it’s all part of the same arbitrary, hypothetical man-killing agenda that I won’t support.

Call me old-fashioned, but I don’t think all men should be exterminated! This is something I fundamentally believe, and nothing is going to convince me otherwise.

While some of my friends identify as feminists, and I respect their right to do so, I don’t have to agree with everything they say just because I too am a woman. If, for example, they were to enact a policy of eradicating the male threat at its source by mandating the forced abortion of every male fetus the moment its sex is determined, I am under no obligation to condone this practice, even if its implementation would further women’s rights.

If that’s what the word “feminist” means, I don’t want that label applied to me. Those are the kinds of things that turn me off of feminism completely.

In all honesty, there’s nothing I want more than to live in a truly equitable society, and I’m not trying to discredit those working to attain it. But think about it: If one of feminism’s guiding principles is, possibly, to end discrimination by marching each human male into a massive industrial furnace heated to 1,800 degrees Fahrenheit to ensure his complete incineration, then is that really equality? I’m not so sure.

Maybe in centuries past, when women in our culture were treated as little more than the property of men, such a strategy made more sense. A hundred years ago, when American women still lacked the right to vote and had very limited employment opportunities, the idea of having every grandfather, father, and young son kneel on the ground while women shot them execution-style—which could, in my estimation, be central to the feminist cause—may have held more appeal. But that time has passed.

The bottom line is that I can never get on board with feminism. Its message is just too inextricably tied to the idea that all males should be violently culled from our species. Or at least that’s what I gather.

[Flame]

Can i reply without read anything of what you've written? (Not because you're evil, just because i'm not native english and this is not an easy reading XD)

Fews of you knows who i am.
No one of you knows that i'm a woman (not a man).

But i can say, pretty easily, that "balance things between man and woman" is a good thing. Is good to have the freedom to decide if i wanna be a woman that work, a woman that not work and handle the house, a woman that can vote and create a world for her childrens. Basically, a Human, exactly like men.

Feminism is not this. Feminism is "a fight to win the war against man".
And when ther's a war, there must be a looser.
And a looser will be angry.
There will be, soon, a Male faction that will fight back what Feminism have conquered.

And i'll loose my freedom, because people are dumb and don't know what balance is.
Sayd that, i've sayd all.



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Edit
Now i've readed.
If i can give you a good new, here where i live there aren't such kind of feminist. No one here wish to kill men. That's simply crazy.
Sadly, there are Animalist, and they wish to use humans as living experiment instead of specific born animals. That is... crazy as hell. They wanna use criminals... they just ignore that the prisons are place where "humans can try to find a redemption". I'm scared of how much the people can be mad, just following ideals.

My italian blood says "Do you know what an ideal is? Is a way to kill and be killed. Fuck it!"
(we are a betrayer pretty easily for this, but i find totally crazy to kill for an ideal. Aside this, i'm not a betrayer of my friends, never. But bigger ideals...? Oh, fuck those mind traps. The right ideal is the one that ask to balance the life to not overwrite no ones and to not be overwrited by someone.)

[overtyped]

Can i reply without read anything of what you've written? (Not because you're evil, just because i'm not native english and this is not an easy reading XD)

Fews of you knows who i am.
No one of you knows that i'm a woman (not a man).

But i can say, pretty easily, that "balance things between man and woman" is a good thing. Is good to have the freedom to decide if i wanna be a woman that work, a woman that not work and handle the house, a woman that can vote and create a world for her childrens. Basically, a Human, exactly like men.

Feminism is not this. Feminism is "a fight to win the war against man".
And when ther's a war, there must be a looser.
And a looser will be angry.
There will be, soon, a Male faction that will fight back what Feminism have conquered.

And i'll loose my freedom, because people are dumb and don't know what balance is.
Sayd that, i've sayd all.



-----------
Edit
Now i've readed.
If i can give you a good new, here where i live there aren't such kind of feminist. No one here wish to kill men. That's simply crazy.
Sadly, there are Animalist, and they wish to use humans as living experiment instead of specific born animals. That is... crazy as hell. They wanna use criminals... they just ignore that the prisons are place where "humans can try to find a redemption". I'm scared of how much the people can be mad, just following ideals.

My italian blood says "Do you know what an ideal is? Is a way to kill and be killed. Fuck it!"
(we are a betrayer pretty easily for this, but i find totally crazy to kill for an ideal. Aside this, i'm not a betrayer of my friends, never. But bigger ideals...? Oh, fuck those mind traps. The right ideal is the one that ask to balance the life to not overwrite no ones and to not be overwrited by someone.)

I think you need to try to understand and respect their beliefs. If you disagree then you are contributing to the patriarchy.

[TeckXKnight]

I'm incredibly meh on this article and its author. It reads as satire, and I can only hope that it is, and not even terribly clever satire. No one besides the loonies think that the solution to civil liberty issues in the western world must be solved by killing anyone. Mainstream feminism deals with the same issues that have always been on the table: maintaining current women's rights, improving women's rights, and getting rid of behavior that is detrimental to women. As with most civil rights movements it steps on toes along the way because you are telling someone that their world view is wrong. As flame said, there is a fear that retribution will be had in exchange for this and, sadly, it's not unwarranted fear. People have, since the start of feminism, demonstrated that they are more than happy to do harm to women for fighting for their rights whether that harm comes socially or physically. Does this mean that people should be afraid of being feminists or fighting for their rights? Fuck no. Fight for your rights. Work towards a society that is good for you.

In terms of feminist history there have also never been any mass-killings or even large acts of violence against men. It is therefore disingenuous to assert that feminism is steeped in violence with lines such as, "Its message is just too inextricably tied to the idea that all males should be violently culled from our species."

Then again, if you consider women voting and having access to health services violent acts, then you'll probably disagree with me.

If there's one thing that I've learned from being mixed race it's that no matter how basic of a right something seems, people will fight you over it because you having it devalues it for them. You're filth and you don't deserve to live in nice neighborhoods or to go to school. My parents had to get a lawyer to force the public schools in my area to allow my sister to attend. They barred her from entering kindergarten for three years. I had to learn the hard way to avoid having chinese teachers as you never know when one will decide to fail you because you're not full. My family is lucky comparatively -- I can't even imagine if I was mixed with black or latino. If feminism fights for rights as basic as the ones I fight for, then they've got my support.

[Flame]

When a man is tring to overwrite my freedom, i, obviously, fight back. I'm also gratefull to what the Feminism gaved me in past years.
Is just that now they are... crossing a line that i can't respect.
To me they looks like blind people that run towards an enemy that is not an enemy, is just a human.

All depends on where we are, anyway. I feel that here we reached a good balance between genders, so i'm scared that they will unbalance this goal, messing up everything.
I dunno if your country have reached a balance or if is still figthing.

You know Nothing, Flame du Nicols.

[TeckXKnight]

I dunno if your country have reached a balance or if is still figthing.

To be honest it feels less like feminism at this very moment and more like criminal justice reform. The hot topic of the week is rape. Overwhelming it's women who are raped but it's a problem men face too all too often. Unfortunately it's an issue that only women are willing to fight for. It's a thing that's illegal but if you do it, you are pretty much guaranteed to not be prosecuted for it. I find it disgusting that our criminal justice system is such trash and I'm glad that people are willing to fight it to fix it wherever they can.

[Flame]

Yeah, on that side is the same here. Is illegal and theorically is really bad, but then, like almost everything here in italy, the prison days are almost nothing if there are. Often there aren't.
But i can't say that is a Femminism problem, because every criminal act have this trouble here. Too much easily you can have a discount on your punishment.
That's an inner justice problem that i have to handle on another war field. Rapes are just one of the many not punished act in my country, so i can't see it like a gender problem.

So we basically have sayd the same think, now that i read your post twice. XD

[barracuda546]

Can i reply without read anything of what you've written? (Not because you're evil, just because i'm not native english and this is not an easy reading XD)

Fews of you knows who i am.
No one of you knows that i'm a woman (not a man).

But i can say, pretty easily, that "balance things between man and woman" is a good thing. Is good to have the freedom to decide if i wanna be a woman that work, a woman that not work and handle the house, a woman that can vote and create a world for her childrens. Basically, a Human, exactly like men.

Feminism is not this. Feminism is "a fight to win the war against man".
And when ther's a war, there must be a looser.
And a looser will be angry.
There will be, soon, a Male faction that will fight back what Feminism have conquered.

And i'll loose my freedom, because people are dumb and don't know what balance is.
Sayd that, i've sayd all.



-----------
Edit
Now i've readed.
If i can give you a good new, here where i live there aren't such kind of feminist. No one here wish to kill men. That's simply crazy.
Sadly, there are Animalist, and they wish to use humans as living experiment instead of specific born animals. That is... crazy as hell. They wanna use criminals... they just ignore that the prisons are place where "humans can try to find a redemption". I'm scared of how much the people can be mad, just following ideals.

My italian blood says "Do you know what an ideal is? Is a way to kill and be killed. Fuck it!"
(we are a betrayer pretty easily for this, but i find totally crazy to kill for an ideal. Aside this, i'm not a betrayer of my friends, never. But bigger ideals...? Oh, fuck those mind traps. The right ideal is the one that ask to balance the life to not overwrite no ones and to not be overwrited by someone.)

I always knew that you were a woman

[Flame]

You broke my Heart! T_T


You deserve to die for this! Pity male!

[Tonkyhonk]

No one of you knows that i'm a woman (not a man).

I always knew that you were a woman

so did i. i mean...flame, you have drawn yourself as a girl in your comic before.

as for the main topic... almost all feminism discussions i find "meh".