is it possible we have 0 goldmines out there ?

[theTrav]

You've got it backwards. If someone was selling gold, all I'd be willing to pay them would be sticks. Maybe a loaf of bread. If I was selling gold to someone else, I wouldn't accept anything less than several dozen wrought iron bars at very least. So the gold isn't going anywhere.

Unfortunately for anyone with gold mines, the seller can't simply set his price. He can only choose to sell for the most a buyer will pay.

I think you're the one who isn't getting it... You're saying that you personally wouldn't buy gold, and also wouldn't sell it for less than an extremely large sum.

Fortunately YOU are not the sole measure of value within haven and hearth.

How much use did a chunk of gold back in the old days have? (before we started using it in electronics)

People wanted it because it was rare and shiny. That gives it value. Practical value. If you come to The City of Brodgar with a single gold coin, you can turn it into a chest, a cart, a silk top hat, a soldiers sword, pretty much whatever you like. In many cases the transformation will take you far longer than gathering the raw materials, and you can carry ONE HUNDRED of these things in a single inventory slot.

How is that not a practical value?

[Peter]

I think you're the one who isn't getting it... You're saying that you personally wouldn't buy gold, and also wouldn't sell it for less than an extremely large sum.
Fortunately YOU are not the sole measure of value within haven and hearth.

I maintain that it is fair to expect that a seller would like to recieve more than it cost him to buy something. In my example, I was saying that I would only buy gold if I could get it for practically free, because I would gain nearly nothing (though I will respond to the Brogdar comment below) by having it. I was also saying that I would only give up gold that I had worked for if I expected to gain something that would have taken that much effort. Mining out four hundred tiles in an extremely difficult to find mine and smelting that with sixteen loads of coal is probably enough work to have produced an entire Jorb-class aircraft carrier out of iron. As you so astutely pointed out, there is a difference between the amount of work it takes to get gold and what you get out at the end.

How much use did a chunk of gold back in the old days have? (before we started using it in electronics)
People wanted it because it was rare and shiny. That gives it value. Practical value.

I'm not talking about the real world. I'm talking about H&H! Of course, even in the real world gold is barely a tool-quality metal. Sure it's fine for electronics, but other than that it's not useful, like water or cement is. I'm all for commodity currency, but it shouldn't be based on gold; it should be based on a "basket" of various essentials- for instance, a guarantee that a dollar is worth 20,000 healthy calories, a gallon of water, and 10,000 watts of energy. That's all besides the point and mostly here to get Jorb to bite.

If you come to The City of Brodgar with a single gold coin, you can turn it into a chest, a cart, a silk top hat, a soldiers sword, pretty much whatever you like. In many cases the transformation will take you far longer than gathering the raw materials, and you can carry ONE HUNDRED of these things in a single inventory slot.
How is that not a practical value?

I haven't the foggiest idea what the CoB plans to do with gold. I agree that that does give gold value, but only so long as Brogdor is interested in acquiring gold. And, of course, it decreases in value the farther from Brogdar you are, because part of each gold coin you earn has to be spent by somebody in order to get it back to Brogdor to cash it in. That is, assume you can buy a hat for 2GP in Brogdar. If you and the hatseller are all the way out in Caketown, though, then it might cost 1GP to buy the food and time you might need to go all the way to brogdar and get the hat; thus, the person selling the hat out in Caketown can safely charge 3GP in the knowledge that you aren't going to spend several hours trudging back and fourth and not save any money. So, the gold is worth 2/3 of it's value due to the distance.

So, as I've said before, gold does have some value- but currently only because of novelty and anticipation. If J&L don't give us something to do with the gold, pretty soon it's going to be worth less and less in comparison to the usable metals.

[theTrav]

So, as I've said before, gold does have some value- but currently only because of novelty and anticipation. If J&L don't give us something to do with the gold, pretty soon it's going to be worth less and less in comparison to the usable metals.

I apologize, I (and I think many others here) are arguing against something you are not intending to put forward, that gold has no value.

You are arguing that gold is GOING to have no value because coinage is its only use, and assuming that other cities and individual vendors are not going to take up an interest in gold.

All I can do is point at the real world and say, look, it happened there. An item with no intrinsic use became incredibly valuable, due to its rareness alone.

Stating that H&H is not the real world doesn't make an obvious counter to that argument.
How do the psychological principals that caused the real world value of gold not apply in H&H? What specifically is the difference that you are pointing out and how does it relate to the comparative value of gold?

[Devour]

Trav, that was also because it was a pretty, easily forgeable metal that could be used in decoration.

[Ruggan]

Pretty much what Devour said. As much as you like to think it, gold IRL and gold in H&H are not the slightest bit alike apart from their name. Some people may be willing to accept it as currency to try and get a currency system off the ground (you/CoB), some people may be willing to accept it because they believe it may have future value and want some before everyone else, but most of us will tell you it's worth nothing until it gets a real purpose.

And saying the CoB will accept it does give it value, like has been previously said. But I'm not going to go through the trouble to have the ability to trade gold coins for food I could make myself, or equipment that I could trade for in easier to create items for bartering. Good luck getting your currency system going, but I'll stick to my bartering until the currency has some meaning.

[Hamel]

Pretty much what Devour said. As much as you like to think it, gold IRL and gold in H&H are not the slightest bit alike apart from their name. Some people may be willing to accept it as currency to try and get a currency system off the ground (you/CoB), some people may be willing to accept it because they believe it may have future value and want some before everyone else, but most of us will tell you it's worth nothing until it gets a real purpose.

And saying the CoB will accept it does give it value, like has been previously said. But I'm not going to go through the trouble to have the ability to trade gold coins for food I could make myself, or equipment that I could trade for in easier to create items for bartering. Good luck getting your currency system going, but I'll stick to my bartering until the currency has some meaning.

When did the Confederacy come into this? I believe you mean TCoB. CoB means (C)onfederation (o)f (B)ottleneck, while TCoB means (T)he (C)ity (o)f (B)rodgar.

Although, I do have ample plans for instituting a currency system into the CoB, which will no doubt have use for gold and silver.