Collapse of EU??

[dagrimreefah]

Are you sure this relation chains relations with all other products?

Why wouldn't it? A good is a good.

[Mateusz_Zboj]

Hmm... makes sense.

[Tonopah]

People in the EU and the US think the recessions and micro depressions are a thing of the past when in reality it's the new normal. Governments take until its all taken up. The real greed is government greed. The autocrats only concern is preserving their way of life - the rest of you fucking stupid proles can suck on it.

Greetings from the late great state of California.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gEcPpROc7Pw

[dagrimreefah]

Governments take until its all taken up. The real greed is government greed.

The autocrats only concern is preserving their way of life

Absolute truth. You speak true wisdom.

[Mateusz_Zboj]

Is the system type wrong, or are we just too weak to stand against?

[Potjeh]

Wait, so you're claiming that markets can only go up naturally, and that any downturn is due to government intervention? So the government made the dot.com bubble pop? Or the government is to blame for massive devaluation of aluminium when the process of smelting it from bauxite was discovered? What about the famous tulip bubble?

[Mateusz_Zboj]

Well, afaic they make laws that help big companies thrive despite their mistakes (vide corporationism).
Of course, that doesn't mean every big fail has something to do with coruption.

[Tonopah]

Simply put, in time all governments become power hungry, coercive and corrupt. Brussels, Washington DC, Moscow and Beijing.

http://www.businessweek.com/globalbiz/c ... 535188.htm

The ability of Bosnia's Serb-dominated entity to fend off lingering suspicions of high-level corruption is again being tested, even as the entity government claims to be launching a new anti-corruption initiative. In the past few months Republika Srpska has lost a large foreign investment amid suspicions of political meddling in major industries and has seen controversy-prone Prime Minister Milorad Dodik embroiled in a corruption scandal of his own. This has made cooperation with Bosnia's international monitors even more contentious and, some analysts believe, may slow the planned transition to a softer, less intrusive international presence throughout the divided country. DODIK HAS A PLAN Last month came the latest episode in a long-running battle of words between the Republika Srpska government and critics from civil society and international bodies, when Dodik reacted angrily to a report of a probe by Bosnian prosecutors into fraud at the highest levels of his government.

https://www.cia.gov/library/publication ... os/bk.html


One of Bosnia's main economic challenges since the recession began has been to reduce spending on public sector wages and social benefits to meet the IMF's criteria for obtaining funding for budget shortfalls. (..) the national currency introduced in 1998 - is pegged to the euro, and confidence in the currency and the banking sector has increased. (..)Government spending, at roughly 50% of GDP, remains high because of redundant government offices at the state, entity and municipal level. Privatization of state enterprises has been slow, particularly in the Federation where political division between ethnically-based political parties makes agreement on economic policy more difficult.

[dagrimreefah]

Wait, so you're claiming that markets can only go up naturally, and that any downturn is due to government intervention? So the government made the dot.com bubble pop?

I never claimed that govts make bubbles. Bubbles can come naturally even in the freest of markets. Central banks (which can't exist w/out gov't) create bubbles too, but much huger, and always with longer lasting and harder downturns than any bubble naturally occurring in the free market. Central banks have created the "business cycle", where booms and busts are a normal occurrence now. In a free market, there is no cycle: bubbles sporadically come and go, and for the most part (at least as much as history tells us) there is steady growth.

Also, yes the dot.com bubble is a prime example of easy credit and foolish investing gone awry, all made possible and perpetuated by the gov't sanctioned central bank.

If you actually take a look at some of the ridiculous, useless, overvalued and unsustainable companies that were started during the dot.com craze, you'd realize why easy credit made possible by a central bank pushing down interest rates is a horribly stupid idea.

EDIT: Also remember, the best way a central bank can artificially push down interest rates is to print more loads of funny money. That means more inflation Enjoy those more expensive goods (like gas)

Well, afaic they make laws that help big companies thrive despite their mistakes (vide corporationism).

Precicely. This is one of my biggest beefs with government. Let them fail

[Potjeh]

So the increasing gas prices have nothing to do with supply growth not keeping up with demand growth? Or is that too a government conspiracy, and there is actually an infinite source of crude oil.

Anyway, markets, being chaotic systems, can generate pretty big recessions on their own. I agree that the governments are making it worse by bailing out unsuccessful companies, though. I don't agree with total non-intervention, though. The government should be acting as a flywheel of the economy, smoothing out the oscillations of the market. But interfering in the private sector is not the way to do it. What should be done IMO is going into debt and using it for infrastructural development (most bridges in USA are way past their intended replacement date), which would stimulate the construction sector, which would in turn stimulate the economy as a whole. But in times of good economy these debts should be repaid, and the governments are failing here because they're taking good economy as a signal to borrow even more.