Should Characters Be Able to Be Perfect In Every Skill?

[minck1]

Where do you find enough bears to get 200k lp per hour?

[Devour]

Where do you find enough bears to get 200k lp per hour?

Apparently boating along.

[Avu]

To be fair you kill everything else too not just bears.

[sabinati]

1. Hit 300 in a combat skill.
2. Farm bears for ridiculous amounts of LP.
3. Hit 500 farming within three days. ( Warri's comment on 200k LP per hour is my basis for this. )
4. Farm better crops than dedicated farmer.
5. lol at everyone else.

fail 1. how long do you think it will take you to get 300 in a combat skill? don't forget that for the combat skill to be meaningful you would also need a great deal of strength
fail 2. have you tried killing a bear with the new combat system? now also factor in the reduced LP gain that has been mentioned.
fail 3. even ignoring 1 and 2, i seriously doubt you could have 200k/lp and hour for 20 hours a day for 3 days
fail 4. it's still going to take approx 4 months of harvesting your crops every day to raise the q from 10 to 500
fail 5. if it's possible for you to do it's possible for everyone else

Nevermind the fact that this character would also be able to easily defend his village in time of an attack and would be able to quickly grind up skills to fill any other potential role in the village. ( The farming he does would probably give him a great deal of LP, probably enough to hit high stats within other skills. )

and why is it a problem that he can defend himself and his village?

My point is that it is possible, with the current LP system, to quite easily hit high skills in other ones than the one you're currently using, due to the high LP gain at the upper end of the tier. This just means good characters get better at things that they are not meant to be good at compared to people who dedicate themselves to a single skill.

so what you're actually wanting is a runescape-like thing where you only get better at a skill by doing that skill? or are you complaining about higher LP gain that upper tier characters get (which helps, but doesn't fully compensate for, the diminishing returns built in to the system)?

Where you're going with this makes no sense, sabi, you're just saying that a group of characters with low skills and a single high one would be better than a single character with lots of high skills. Which is true, in a way, when you consider time usage.

But, a group of characters with lots of high skills are far superior to a group of characters each dedicated to a single skill. And, really, with bear farming it's not that hard to do.

a group of characters each with 10m LP that each specialize in one skill is better than a character with 10m LP and an even distribution of skills. what part of that is not registering with you?

@Pascal666: What's the point in playing a multiplayer game if you're unwilling to play with other players? There is, after all, Harvest Moon for you to play if you don't want to. That doesn't even have other players who can fuck your work up. The reason for a cap is so that players don't have to grind up a bunch of seperate skills, only a few of them. Say three skills to a theoretical "max". That would give players enough dedication to each individual skill whilst giving them a bit of flexibility in terms of choices.

where does he say he doesn't want to play with other players?

and finally, jorb has said before that he hates the idea of caps, so what is the point in playing a game that is uncapped by design if you want to play a game with caps? There is, after all, World of Warcraft for you to play if you don't want to. That does have skill caps. The reason for not having skill caps is so that players can do whatever they want because it's a sandbox. If they want to focus on three skills they can, or if they want to spend lp on all skills they can.

[warrri]

Beside, if you whine so much, why dont you just get perfect in every skill yourself, while i continue making q300 rings because i specialized in smithing, while my friend provides me with q150 food because he specialized in farming and a bit of cooking, while my other friend keeps making me q~170 leather pants because he specialized in sewing. Is that okay for you?

[Devour]

fail 1. how long do you think it will take you to get 300 in a combat skill? don't forget that for the combat skill to be meaningful you would also need a great deal of strength
fail 2. have you tried killing a bear with the new combat system? now also factor in the reduced LP gain that has been mentioned.
fail 3. even ignoring 1 and 2, i seriously doubt you could have 200k/lp and hour for 20 hours a day for 3 days
fail 4. it's still going to take approx 4 months of harvesting your crops every day to raise the q from 10 to 500
fail 5. if it's possible for you to do it's possible for everyone else

HURR.

Faceplant 1. Not THAT long, really, quite a bit of time, but with maxed beliefs it wouldn't be the hardest thing in the world. Macroable. Macro eating bear bangers, maybe? Simple enough.
Faceplant 2. The old system, the new system is going to have a shit tonne of changes done to it. It's a temporary thing, so your point is sort of invalid.
Faceplant 3. Why?
Faceplant 4. Harvest crops -> Hunt bears -> Return and harvest crops -> Hunt bears.
Faceplant 5. Except some people don't have all day to play the game.

and why is it a problem that he can defend himself and his village?

DURR.

It's a problem that he can defend himself and his village, and then go farm and then go bake and then go do carpentry and then go do something else etc etc.

so what you're actually wanting is a runescape-like thing where you only get better at a skill by doing that skill? or are you complaining about higher LP gain that upper tier characters get (which helps, but doesn't fully compensate for, the diminishing returns built in to the system)?

It would make more sense, yes, to have a UO-esque system ( Runescape ripped it off, okay? ) in which your proficiency in the skill increases as you do it. The Runescape system still didn't have a cap, however, which lead to people doing nothing but macroing themselves into the best in every skill. Which is still damn stupid.

a group of characters each with 10m LP that each specialize in one skill is better than a character with 10m LP and an even distribution of skills. what part of that is not registering with you?

The fact they're MARGINALLY better than that character. A group of characters with 100m LP in one skill compared to a character with 100m LP in all skills is about 2/10 better in each individual skill. That's tiny, to be perfectly honest.

where does he say he doesn't want to play with other players?

and finally, jorb has said before that he hates the idea of caps, so what is the point in playing a game that is uncapped by design if you want to play a game with caps? There is, after all, World of Warcraft for you to play if you don't want to. That does have skill caps. The reason for not having skill caps is so that players can do whatever they want because it's a sandbox. If they want to focus on three skills they can, or if they want to spend lp on all skills they can.

"I am saying that it's pointless to cap individual skills, because at some point it will be almost pointless to continue training, and limiting skills for specialization would harm a lot of players that do not like to participate in political bullshit/city life." Basically, what he's saying is, "Players that don't like to interact other players can't play this multiplayer online game."

Which is why the best sandboxes of all time ( Star Wars Galaxies and Ultima Online ) had caps? I'm sure that, over time, Jorb's mind will change and he'll understand the effect that caps has on a game. Due to the facts that a skill cap ( as in how high an individual skill can rise ) means that you will never get characters that can wipe the floor with newbies ( which it eventually will be in the current system, no matter how long that takes ) and you will not really need character reset ( which is necessary in the current system, due to the formerly mentioned reasons ). Also, a skill cap ( as in how much "skill level" you can have overall ) encourages a community and for players to interact with each other, for good or for bad.

It would give a REASON to raiding, as an example, instead of just general douchebaggery.

[minck1]

If someone has enough time to grind 100M LP, they have enough time to grind 6 specialists to 10M LP caps. I have mixed feelings about caps. They do give casual players a slightly more competitive playing field but hardcore players always find a way around them.

[theTrav]

HUR DUR HUR

[Devour]

If someone has enough time to grind 100M LP, they have enough time to grind 6 specialists to 10M LP caps. I have mixed feelings about caps. They do give casual players a slightly more competitive playing field but hardcore players always find a way around them.

I have to admit, it's not as effective here as it would be in a subscription game with a single character slot.

But the growth of each individual character would be considerably slower, especially if Jorb implements the wyrd system.

[warrri]

WOuldnt it be easier with wyrd, because the actions are limited per day. So i just make a specialized alt for every stat and do every action as many times as its possible per day.