Hearth vaults.

[Malenkoe_Zlo]

I wonder if making criminal acts harder to use can solve anything.
Hearthlings seem to be trigger-happy muderers. Can't we add the "weight of the crime" debuff each time a crime is commited? To represent guilt or fear. It would lower stats and skills of the criminal by some percentage, depending on crime. Tresspassing would be a lighter crime (maybe 0.5% debuff), while murder is the heaviest (maybe 10% debuff). I think that different crimes should have different debuff time.

It might be applied not when crime is commited, but when someone tracks scents, via an option. Of course, 1 debuff per scent, so you can't give a similar scent to bunch of alts. Also, the severety of a debuff should have some relation with a distance to HF of criminal. Closer to HF - stronger debuff.

If a buff is applied at the moment of commiting a crime, a "guilt sharing" might be intoduced. If a criminal is in the party, the debuff would be spread among party members, with thoose who have higher charisma suffering more (to prevent using a lots of newbie alts).

To reduce a debuff, criminal might do some peaceful work (such as farming), or let his ancestors judge him. To do the latter, HF should be outside with an altar near it to "let the ancestors to gaze upon ye from sky/heaven/valhalla etc.", maybe with some active praying involved.

[DatOneGuy]

I wonder if making criminal acts harder to use can solve anything.
Hearthlings seem to be trigger-happy muderers. Can't we add the "weight of the crime" debuff each time a crime is commited? To represent guilt or fear. It would lower stats and skills of the criminal by some percentage, depending on crime. Tresspassing would be a lighter crime (maybe 0.5% debuff), while murder is the heaviest (maybe 10% debuff). I think that different crimes should have different debuff time.

It might be applied not when crime is commited, but when someone tracks scents, via an option. Of course, 1 debuff per scent, so you can't give a similar scent to bunch of alts. Also, the severety of a debuff should have some relation with a distance to HF of criminal. Closer to HF - stronger debuff.

If a buff is applied at the moment of commiting a crime, a "guilt sharing" might be intoduced. If a criminal is in the party, the debuff would be spread among party members, with thoose who have higher charisma suffering more (to prevent using a lots of newbie alts).

To reduce a debuff, criminal might do some peaceful work (such as farming), or let his ancestors judge him. To do the latter, HF should be outside with an altar near it to "let the ancestors to gaze upon ye from sky/heaven/valhalla etc.", maybe with some active praying involved.

Not so sure on the debuff, sounds dangerous.

really don't like it being applied by others or anything like that. I don't really believe in debuffs of scents, maybe if you started with a buff like anxiety of being in the moment and then a debuff shortly after, like a 'coming down' kinda deal. Overall though not a fan of buffs/debuffs around crimes though.

[Potjeh]

This is what i have the biggest problem with. IT's a death sentence pure and simple. How do you defend against this. the only way is with larger more complex vaults. Or have a large enough force to actually fight it out. And if this is your goal, my personal opinion is Haven will get real boring as to many would-be villains get sick of have no hope and quit. your alienating an entire play style.

Good, because it's supposed to alienate that playing style. If the devs wanted people to roleplay lone psychopats and get away with it they wouldn't have implemented summoning in the first place. The fact that *anyone* can go and gank newbies at will at zero risk whatsoever to him is the main reason that the game's population is stagnating. You have to be ignorant or crazy to start playing H&H nowadays.

So yeah, if you want to kill everyone you meet, go play an FPS.

[Sarchi]

You don't want to alienate criminals either, though. Criminals are necessary in order to make this game interesting. Otherwise, it's like playing a Facebook game, and people will quit anyway.

[Potjeh]

Fuck lone criminals, I want kingdoms to fight. And that will never happen as long as there's zero reason to band together.

[bmjclark]

You don't want to alienate criminals either, though. Criminals are necessary in order to make this game interesting. Otherwise, it's like playing a Facebook game, and people will quit anyway.

I'm all for criminals, but they should have to have 1 base of operations, not 30 =)

[Potjeh]

What I think is really needed is some rethinking of the fast travel system where distance actually matters. That way large villages can make large policed areas where random thieves and murderers quickly die, and we can have remote areas where those guys steal and murder at will. So a new player can pick their poison - "oppressive" civilization or dangerous wilderness.

[Treetheater]

What I think is really needed is some rethinking of the fast travel system where distance actually matters. That way large villages can make large policed areas where random thieves and murderers quickly die, and we can have remote areas where those guys steal and murder at will. So a new player can pick their poison - "oppressive" civilization or dangerous wilderness.

Of all the ideas suggested, I still think this one has the most promise besides redoing sieges altogether. I don't think it should be ranger activated, like some people are saying, I think it should just be automatic. If you're 3 supergrids away from where you were 10 minutes ago, the game could easily see that, and lock your hf for a proportionate amount of time. Maybe an amount of time in relation with how long it should ACTUALLY take to get to that spot with boating/wakling. This would cause 0 problems for new players, as moving your hf within say a 300 tile radius or something, wouldn't start the timer. The only time I can see this effecting legitimate players is when they decide to move a decent distance away, and notice I said 'effect' not 'hurt'. I don't see why anyone without a ranger on their back would be upset about not being able to move their hf whenever they want. Basically, if you don't want to be tracked, don't commit crimes. Which is exactly how this game should work, not "I can commit any crime I want, tracking mechanics be damned!".



Another way the situation could be dealt with would be, y'know, us, the players. It's pretty ludicrous to imagine, but It'd be awesome to see a week/month in this game where there's just an all out war between vaulters/everyone else. Placing multiple rams at any vault you see, criminals become discouraged from warping, because who knows if the grass is greener on the other side, or on fire... But this would require a lot of participation, planning, patience and I ultimately don't see it happening. Plus, god knows what they'll think of next after being backed into THAT corner.

It would be awesome though.


edit - Another thing I don't understand : Aren't hv's making the game incredibly boring for criminals? Isn't the taboo, the rush of the crime, greatly diminished if you are 95% sure you won't get caught/punished? I certainly don't commit crimes with the intention of being caught, but the chance that it could happen is always in the back of my mind. It's what makes the game exciting.

[Achilles]

@Potjeh
That doesn't help as the world is not big enough. Also, raiders will spend few hours for travelling more readily then 'police'.

@Treetheater
Less criminal means less drama. I guess most people still can't decide what they prefer.

[Treetheater]

@Potjeh
That doesn't help as the world is not big enough. Also, raiders will spend few hours for travelling more readily then 'police'.

@Treetheater
Less criminal means less drama. I guess most people still can't decide what they prefer.

People using hearth vaults have become more than criminals, they're practically gods of the game. Regardless of the players stats, if they are in a vault, they are untouchable. Free to carry out their will on who/whatever they want. They are, essentially, playing a completely different game than the rest of us. They have no worries whatsoever about other people doing things to them.