Debate about RMT in Haven and Hearth

[Tonkyhonk]

DoG,

just like you have complained and questioned many trading threads for their prices, i am complaining its price. others should see some are doubting the appropriateness. the decision will be made by those informed either way and the decision itself is their own choice.

[DatOneGuy]

DoG,

just like you have complained and questioned many trading threads for their prices, i am complaining its price. others should see some are doubting the appropriateness. the decision will be made by those informed either way and the decision itself is their own choice.

Yes and whenever asked by the creator of the thread my posts were removed

So we can talk about it here and discuss the morality overall of selling items, but we cannot derail their threads with this bullshit because in the end just like others they are trading items and it is their right to a clean trading thread like all others.

[Tonkyhonk]

I don't think real life transactions should be approved or promoted but I don't think they should be discouraged nor banned.

the community should discourage such actions imo.
whether it should not be discouraged nor banned officially is totally up to devs, not you.

Isn't it also your assumption that people will start to sell resources weapons and armors too? My assumption that the players wouldn't sell them is because I've played with the big end-game villages. Its a highly competitive atmosphere, they play for the competition and the enjoyment of the game so if selling the resources and gear would truly ruin the game I'm pretty sure they wouldn't do it.

buying resources is an action already happening now. bribing for war has already happened on previous worlds.
similar things have happened on many games illegally and many game companies are having hard time dealing with it.

sure, Sodom would have never sold items which might give power to others, Pande wouldnt sell, nor BN. but what do you expect when a GoldFarming village appears? you are a step forward to one of such potential villages, rye. sweatshops wouldnt care if they win the game or not, but they care if they win real life money.

Also I doubt we would ever see the kinda of sweatshops that games like World of Warcraft have because this is such a small unstable (its run by 2 guys and there are frequentish resets) game. There's not enough money to get a big enough group dedicated to selling stuff that it would ruin the game. They could just get real jobs as you insist I should do if I want to make money.

you really dont know where a sweatshop can come from. it never has to be a big enough group. all they need is the information of the demand. when professionals start it unlike yourself doing it privately, they dont have to concentrate on one game.

[Tonkyhonk]

DoG,

just like you have complained and questioned many trading threads for their prices, i am complaining its price. others should see some are doubting the appropriateness. the decision will be made by those informed either way and the decision itself is their own choice.

Yes and whenever asked by the creator of the thread my posts were removed

So we can talk about it here and discuss the morality overall of selling items, but we cannot derail their threads with this bullshit because in the end just like others they are trading items and it is their right to a clean trading thread like all others.

gah, point taken. ┗(；´Д｀)┛

at least, that thread should have a big link to this, so new comers can clearly see its potential danger.

many people are stupid enough to believe that green names are "admins" instead of just "forum garbage men"
they would surely mistake the mods' actions of not doing anything to such threads as "approved" unfortunately.
go ahead and call in more stupid players who would do anything to win the game, hey?

[novaalpha]

gah, point taken. ┗(；´Д｀)┛

Is that an r2d2

[Tonkyhonk]

gah, point taken. ┗(；´Д｀)┛

Is that an r2d2

now, this is called the true derailing... other complaints on that thread which are all on this thread now WERE NOT.

[rye130]

I don't think real life transactions should be approved or promoted but I don't think they should be discouraged nor banned.

the community should discourage such actions imo.
whether it should not be discouraged nor banned officially is totally up to devs, not you.

Isn't it also your assumption that people will start to sell resources weapons and armors too? My assumption that the players wouldn't sell them is because I've played with the big end-game villages. Its a highly competitive atmosphere, they play for the competition and the enjoyment of the game so if selling the resources and gear would truly ruin the game I'm pretty sure they wouldn't do it.

buying resources is an action already happening now. bribing for war has already happened on previous worlds.
similar things have happened on many games illegally and many game companies are having hard time dealing with it.

sure, Sodom would have never sold items which might give power to others, Pande wouldnt sell, nor BN. but what do you expect when a GoldFarming village appears? you are a step forward to one of such potential villages, rye. sweatshops wouldnt care if they win the game or not, but they care if they win real life money.

Also I doubt we would ever see the kinda of sweatshops that games like World of Warcraft have because this is such a small unstable (its run by 2 guys and there are frequentish resets) game. There's not enough money to get a big enough group dedicated to selling stuff that it would ruin the game. They could just get real jobs as you insist I should do if I want to make money.

you really dont know where a sweatshop can come from. it never has to be a big enough group. all they need is the information of the demand. when professionals start it unlike yourself doing it privately, they dont have to concentrate on one game.

I'll give you that the community probably should discourage it, but people are acting like its some huge issue when really there a much bigger issues that should be dealt with.

Yes buying resources is already happened. People don't sell their top quality gear and resources to just anybody so that they can stay on top. The people with the top quality gear and resources are hardworking players, and it will always be the hardworking organized group of players that are at the top and they are the people that won't sell top quality gear.

I understood what you meant by sweatshop and I don't think professionals at selling ingame items would come to this game because its not big enough nor stable enough, like I said before. Why bother with this game when they can make more money in games like World of Warcraft or by just having an actual job? Also I assume professionals get their merchandise by using bots. So what is the real problem, paying real money for stuff or botting? I think botting is the bigger issue.

[Jackard]

I may be looking at his meaning wrong, but I assume what Loftar means is that in game trade is what they work towards, not people meeting outside planning trades and porting to trade etc

afaik this is correct. they eventually want to create an ingame tutorial as well

probably the only reasons Apples for Oranges exists is

1) other forums arent filled with inevitable trade spam
2) Jorb might be interested in this stuff, i remember him trading through IRC in world 2

[Tonkyhonk]

I understood what you meant by sweatshop and I don't think professionals at selling ingame items would come to this game because its not big enough nor stable enough, like I said before. Why bother with this game when they can make more money in games like World of Warcraft or by just having an actual job?

that is called an assumption. you are being naive.
do you think the competition of goldfarmers on WoW is easier to earn money when they always have the risk of bans?
remember what you said, you were one of those who insisted to go hunting on w3 only to catch up LPs with others.
when more start to happen, people would start using the same reasonings over RMT "to catch up with others".

Also I assume professionals get their merchandise by using bots. So what is the real problem, paying real money for stuff or botting? I think botting is the bigger issue.

the real problem is, allowing those players and/or goldfarmers to prosper, who would basically never care about abusing any problems we have or game breaking events. the moral of the community will be lowered even more than what we have right here. more botting non-stop, more bug-abuse without reports, griefing for cash, which leads to more RMT to win, etc, etc.

[sillynipples]

The fastest way to succeed at haven and hearth, from my experience, is to team up with people with better stats than you. They can usually provide good curios for free. Join a village or something, there's no need to spend real money on this stuff.