Bugfixes: Banners & Familiars

[MagicManICT]

That's completely wrong. Civilization is much more favored then PvP. One can sit inside his/hers Brick wall for the whole world, by simply ram checking everyday and they would never be able to be raided..

If anyone wants to break into your walls bad enough, they're going to do it. Ram-sitting will probably prevent those care bears from sticking their nose out of their walls to destroy the ram before it dries. It's probably be the most tedious task in the game as there won't be much to do 95% of the time. Haven just doesn't have enough people to make it practical, though. There have definitely been battles where raiders have sat by the ram to keep it from getting destroyed.

If you don't bother anyone and stay safe behind your brick wall and stay friendly to your neighbors, the chances of getting raided are slim as it would require time from players that probably just isn't worth the effort. However, one should never feel completely safe no matter the precautions taken.

[APXEOLOG]

Doing away with curios and LP wouldn't be "that" hard. Just make it so that as you use a skill, it goes up. Of course this is still bot and exploitable, but let's face it. What isn't?

There's a reason why no one did this after UO (Which isn't quite true, there have been a number of very unsuccessful mmos that have attempted this since then while trying to be successors to UO). There's 'possible to bot' and then there is 'designed for bots to play and not players.'

Every game is 'possible to bot'. WoW full of bots (even leveling and quest bots), same as all old and new MMOs.

[TeckXKnight]

The point I was trying to make was that some are easier than others. More complex systems tend to be a bit more resilient to botting than simpler ones.

[Emina]

ohh well comparing botting from other games or discussing how to get rid of bots does not really help us much.

Fact is, bots exist in most games. The difference is how much impact the botting has on the game as a result.

Botters in wow hardley has any impact on the game other then the people buying those botted chars tend to be completley crappy in the end game since they lack experience with that particular char. Hence botting has no real advantage and a very low impact on the game.

where in haven we have permadeath and no stat limit. You can basically "win" the game with botting, and has a very large impact on the game compared to wow.

i think everyone can agree that there will always be bots in one way or another, its unavoidable.
Tricky part is how to lower the bots impact on the game.

[Aldebaran]

It is a noble concept to attempt to employ in a game except the creation and maintenance of a horde of alts diminishes a loss to some as a mere inconvenience. Alts or not as long as people will create ways to preserve their work and time investment.

It`s not only about work preservation, it`s about efficiency. On my little farm I usually end up with a huge quantities of curios, but of just a few types; so it`s as easy to fill "study" of five alts as to fill one. Why would I train a farmer-cook with a daily LP income of, say, 20k LP, when I can have a farmer AND a cook with a daily income of 20k LP EACH? That would be an obvious handicap.

Back then, when LP gain was tied only to time spent and work done, I used one char for all in-farm jobs (sewing, farming, etc) and one for hunting-foraging, just to cut off risks. It didn`t matter whether I played 1 char for 1 hour or two alts for half an hour each, I gained the same amount of LP anyway.

[LadyV]

It is a noble concept to attempt to employ in a game except the creation and maintenance of a horde of alts diminishes a loss to some as a mere inconvenience. Alts or not as long as people will create ways to preserve their work and time investment.

It`s not only about work preservation, it`s about efficiency. On my little farm I usually end up with a huge quantities of curios, but of just a few types; so it`s as easy to fill "study" of five alts as to fill one. Why would I train a farmer-cook with a daily LP income of, say, 20k LP, when I can have a farmer AND a cook with a daily income of 20k LP EACH? That would be an obvious handicap.

Back then, when LP gain was tied only to time spent and work done, I used one char for all in-farm jobs (sewing, farming, etc) and one for hunting-foraging, just to cut off risks. It didn`t matter whether I played 1 char for 1 hour or two alts for half an hour each, I gained the same amount of LP anyway.

Yes and as I said the loss of an alt has little impact. It gets replaced rather quickly unless its ultra high skilled. As for efficiency its set in the early colonial period such thoughts dont exist yet.

[ydex]

Yes and as I said the loss of an alt has little impact. It gets replaced rather quickly unless its ultra high skilled. As for efficiency its set in the early colonial period such thoughts dont exist yet.

well just because the thought doesnt excist IRL at that time doesnt mean i cant apply it, right? cause its fictional n all that?

[LadyV]

well just because the thought doesnt excist IRL at that time doesnt mean i cant apply it, right? cause its fictional n all that?

You are perfectly capable of doing so. I'm just merely suggesting you change the game by doing so.

[ydex]

well just because the thought doesnt excist IRL at that time doesnt mean i cant apply it, right? cause its fictional n all that?

You are perfectly capable of doing so. I'm just merely suggesting you change the game by doing so.

lol fair enough, i refuse to play as a scrub tho. need to WIN

[Robben_DuMarsch]

The point I was trying to make was that some are easier than others. More complex systems tend to be a bit more resilient to botting than simpler ones.

Aye, progression shouldn't be the result of repetition in a well designed game. Meaningful interactions and complex decisions.