Prelude: World 15

[VDZ]

You can't die if you're a PVPer, and death makes you stronger. Dipshit.

Literally though, my farming was higher just after my death than it was before my death, post death I wasn't as scared of dieing so I tripled my stats in a month, I didn't even bother spending Numan points, takes long to collect them than it does to just eat and study.

Never be afraid of death, embrace it like an old friend.

I assume you're being sarcastic, but death making PvPers stronger is an actual thing. Death resets your hunger to 300% which is more beneficial for attribute (not skill) growth than it is disadvantageous. See Snail's C&I thread 'Why the current hunger/feasting system SUCKS' for the death part and my C&I thread 'Remove 300% and 200% hunger levels' for hunger being broken (it works slightly different now compared to when it was originally written, but the core problem remains). Death is detrimental for farmers but beneficial to fighters.

[vatas]

- Hardcap skills and stats

They tried that in w9 and it just made the whole game stagnate once people reached the hardcap.

Rolling stat cap to prevent tryhards constantly ahead of the curve could work, but we already have the UA normalization which means the tryhard needs more than twice your stats for it to matter. Considering that raising stats gets harder the higher they are, this works pretty well.

The main reason for the low interest in PvP is the cost of losing a character and the impossibility of an industrial comeback. The death of pets and the loss of things that you cannot get yourself pushes you back in quality forever.

I assume you're referring to the massive blow that is losing your base and all the infrastructure on it. My advice: befriend people. Even if they can't help you defend, they can help you rebuild (possibly elsewhere.)

[Potjeh]

Sure, but you guys are still a tiny minority when you look at the playerbase at a world reset. What would keep a lot more people playing is axing all the mandatory maintenance shit, which is made necessary by the game's character and quality progression mechanics. Imagine being able to log in and decide what you want to do, like go craft some hard to get item or go do a dungeon, without being forced to do a million maintenance chores first. Or heck, even being able to not log in at at all if you don't feel like it, and still being able to pick up right where you left after a week or month long break. Most people start playing at world reset to see all the new content that came out since they last played. They don't log in to check out new content as it's released because getting to it requires running through a lot of basic content first, and they'd have to do it all from scratch every time because all the progress from playing previously has been lost to decay.

You blame this on progression mechanics, but isn't this mainly caused by failure timers? If you don't refuel your steel in time, the process fails. If you don't feed your animals in time, they die. And so on. If the penalty for not doing certain activities were removed, the only disadvantage would be that you don't progress as fast as the top players, which for the vast majority of players wasn't going to be the case anyways.

Animals are a huge problem because if they die you lose the quality progress. Steel in theory isn't as bad because you don't need to do it constantly, you can just do a big batch one time and have enough for a long while. Except you can't do a big batch because you only have a couple top q crucibles.

Quality is the real problem here. Remove it from the game completely. Instead of grinding up a bone kiln to be able to make a better bone kiln to raise the quality of the metal, we should be making bone kiln to be able to make bone clay bricks so we can build top tier smelter which is required to smelt top tier ore. Also, removing quality makes any bear as good as any other bear, and looking for high q animal spawns sucks almost as much as looking for high q clay and water.

Seriously, quality progression is just a tedious way of extending the content, and it's completely unneeded when there's enough content to have actual qualitative progression, like for example having tiers of picks for accessing higher tier ores.

[Dawidio123]

Rolling stat cap to prevent tryhards constantly ahead of the curve could work, but we already have the UA normalization which means the tryhard needs more than twice your stats for it to matter. Considering that raising stats gets harder the higher they are, this works pretty well.

Tbh having all combat stats be equalized now just like uac makes it basically the same as combat stat cap for all use cases except fighting shitters that you can double or early game when everyone didn't have same stats, but with an illusion of progress as you further grind stats but nothing changes.

[SnuggleSnail]

There would be nothing to do the majority of the time without quality or stats to grind, tbh.

There needs to be a reason to login. There needs to be a time investment in your character/village to care about it.

The problem is Jorb listens to people who use bots, have personal developers, play in a village with 100+ people, work from home and are logged in 16 hours a day complaining they run out of things to do. Or not playing the game enough to realize nobody wants to spend literally 8 hours a day herding to get the same quality/gen as their neighbors.

My daily haven tasks should be done in 30 minutes so I can get distracted by something fun, not a 5 hour chore I wake up every day dreading and only do because I'm sunk cost fallacying hard until the first winter lets me out of my loop and I never come back.

[VDZ]

Animals are a huge problem because if they die you lose the quality progress. Steel in theory isn't as bad because you don't need to do it constantly, you can just do a big batch one time and have enough for a long while. Except you can't do a big batch because you only have a couple top q crucibles.

Quality is the real problem here. Remove it from the game completely. Instead of grinding up a bone kiln to be able to make a better bone kiln to raise the quality of the metal, we should be making bone kiln to be able to make bone clay bricks so we can build top tier smelter which is required to smelt top tier ore. Also, removing quality makes any bear as good as any other bear, and looking for high q animal spawns sucks almost as much as looking for high q clay and water.

Seriously, quality progression is just a tedious way of extending the content, and it's completely unneeded when there's enough content to have actual qualitative progression, like for example having tiers of picks for accessing higher tier ores.

Item quality is a fundamental element of the game. You might dislike it, and we could argue about its merits and problems, but the devs aren't going to entirely remove it. Rather than making suggestions that aren't going to be implemented, it's better to point out where it causes issues and think about what can be done to address that (other than removing the quality system entirely). For example, in the case of steel: how much does crucible quality capping add to steelmaking? Would an alternative option be to have crucibles not affect steel quality? How should the quality formula work to prevent high-quality steel from being too easy to make?

[vatas]

The problem is Jorb listens to people who use bots, have personal developers, play in a village with 100+ people, work from home and are logged in 16 hours a day complaining they run out of things to do. Or not playing the game enough to realize nobody wants to spend literally 8 hours a day herding to get the same quality/gen as their neighbors.

Are these the same people asking for a bigger world, or has Jorb developed immaculate ability to cherrypick worst possible feedback?

[SnuggleSnail]

Trollex asking for anvil spiraling to return comes to mind, even though I agree with him on 99% of his opinions just not where he wants the needle to be.

The game may as well have anvil spiraling though, considering questing is effectively a non-time gated way to infinitely grind quality same as world 10 spiraling.

I'm personally very team infinite stat grinding as an end game, as opposed to infinite quality grinding since a single person having retarded stats isn't that impactful compared to an entire faction having retarded quality armor & dominating trade & gaining stats faster anyway because of their qualities.

Unlike a lot of my other opinions I'm pretty happy to say these are subjective and prolly wrong tho

[noindyfikator]

@Jorbtar

Can we get before next world ONE, just ONE food item which gives EXACTLY 0 hunger, 0 FEP and 1000 energy, PLEASE? Let us eat dirt...

Photo from real life for visualization:

[jtpitner]

Hmm