Pre-Announcement: Siege Changes

[Vaku]

Again, one hour? 30 minutes? Does coles not have some sort of point?

30 minutes with an alert to village members akin to the Altar of Ruin.

Cole's does have a point. This incarnation does allow attackers to whittle defenses in such a way that it leaves defenders little time to respond.

Siege device should also possess an amount of dmg soak relative to attackers tied to the use of the device, within proximity of the device.

Such as 1 incriment of soak offered by one RAM operator, and in another instance, 4 increments of soak offered by 4 ram operators.

This redirects the focus of defenders toward repelling the actual attacking players over attacking the siege implement.

Key to victory means holding the siege implement as an attacker. If attacking, and you get shooed away from the siege device, you lose your advantage, and risk device's destruction.

The time for this event falls into a more tolerable range. 30 minutes waiting to dry, and potentially 30 mins attacking/defending.

Hrm. I have other thoughts, but am not in the position to write or read a lot. But this looks like a great update nonetheless.

[MightySheep]

an alert to village members akin to the Altar of Ruin.

What is actually so bad about being able to do a sneak attack? Isn't it an interesting scenario? People who live in a village should at least be active enough to notice somebody firing catapults at their walls for 12 hours without needing alerts, isn't amber alert enough?

This redirects the focus of defenders toward repelling the actual attacking players over attacking the siege implement.

I agree with this notion, defenders shouldn't be able to just hit and run enemy siege weapons, especially not with alts. At the very least they should be slow to bash.

[Vaku]

an alert to village members akin to the Altar of Ruin.

What is actually so bad about being able to do a sneak attack? Isn't it an interesting scenario? People who live in a village should at least be active enough to notice somebody firing catapults at their walls for 12 hours without needing alerts, isn't amber alert enough?

I don't disagree with you here.. But, I do think the pot shots, or the damage done with a catpult should be in some way obvious.

Good village planning dictates there should be no blindspot in your town, an area within which you don't pass for 24hrs... That said, not everyone knows to plan a village well, or they claim more land than they have manpower to cover.

Should players, I.e. hermits and small villages be at greater innate risk in a system that allows sneaky catapult shots, or should the footing be a little more evened? I think it comes down to what is fun for both the defender and attacker.

It is my impression that attackers want a fight, therefore a village alert may be a good thing. And it is also my impression that defenders want to know they are being attacked. It is a win-win, in my book, and thus options for subterfuge and sabatoge should be approached differently, in a system that does not use a war machines like rams and catapults. Etc. Etc.

[stya]

an alert to village members akin to the Altar of Ruin.

What is actually so bad about being able to do a sneak attack? Isn't it an interesting scenario? People who live in a village should at least be active enough to notice somebody firing catapults at their walls for 12 hours without needing alerts, isn't amber alert enough?

This redirects the focus of defenders toward repelling the actual attacking players over attacking the siege implement.

I agree with this notion, defenders shouldn't be able to just hit and run enemy siege weapons, especially not with alts. At the very least they should be slow to bash.

Any custom client could make an alert by checking the village shield. To avoid the advantage of which client you use, an alert in vanilla client would be nice.

[sabinati]

You can inspect the ground to see your shield

[Vaku]

You can inspect the ground to see your shield

I've inspected my shields once, just to see that I could do it.

I would not wish upon anyone that shield inspections becomes another daily chore, because that's what it'll become.

Attacking and being attacked should be fun and in many ways obvious—rubble spawning, craters forming, etc., and simply knowing the hotkeys: A > S > click seems like something I shouldn't have to know if my village is being pelted with fire and brimstone.

[Sever]

I've had a stupid idea. When you go through a gate and you get a visitor debuff, you can't do crimes. What if when you break a wall, those tiles trigger a different "raider" debuff, which comes with some sort of conditions? I'm not really sure if anything I've come up with is any good.

1. Vandalism is simply not possible for raiders.
2. Most crimes are normal, but vandalism (and possibly but probably not murder) performed during a raid allows for much stronger than usual nidbanes. It could encourage raiders to knock people out instead of just killing them (which should be easier to control, btw)
3. Vandalism deals SHP damage continuously while raiding. Maybe not a lot, but enough to discourage doing it.

I agree with Coles' point about instant catapult raiding being a problem. I don't think you can solve it with a time limit. If a village checks enough, 30 minutes is too long. If everyone is offline for more than a few hours, it's too short and the shield can easily be whittled away.

Regardless of my own suggestion, in suggesting it, I think I've realized that the problem is still hanging on a single point of failure. Maybe different kinds of things can be accomplished with different kinds of siege engines. It was once suggested that a simple thief could climb a wall or build a ladder (which might have a drying time maybe I dunno) a "thief" debuff would allow you to only steal and defend yourself, not attack. The battering ram would allow you to bust open a gate (leaving it wrecked and unusable, but eventually repairable) and passing through the gate then would give you the "raider" debuff from above. The catapult, allowing you to bust through the wall, allows you to execute any criminals you have the scents for, or possibly allow any murder.

I'm not gonna pretend I didn't come up with all that in five minutes, but all of that and more could go into this system to give raiders many, many options, keeping villagers on the lookout instead of panicking that a single point of failure could destroy everything they've worked for.

[Vert]

3 types of fraction here
1) trade faction with huge amount of resourse, without good online on their warriors. This fraction want to spaming they resourses for winning.
2) raiders from begining of the world that kill newbies a lot and didnt spend time on rise quality. This fraction want to destroy top village and get top resourses while the village sleep in 12 hours after patch. (MightySheep)
3) village with fighters. That fraction want to get time of attack and then came and rect.

so this patch about first two type of village, about village that didnt get enough power to fight.
So if we are talking about first type of village (DIS) they just spent 1 000 resourse and destroy village, but if you want destroy DIS you must spend 10 000 instead. So we need fix on multiple village. DIS didnt spend resourse for defence but got extra defence for no cost. x10 def

when we talking about siege with 1 hour catapults we must understand that they cost too low. price must be increase by 2 pearls or 1 gold bar or something to prevent spamming.
Moreover we can say game has 3 stage start, middle, end. Now we are in middle game and the resourse for building catapult is too low. But if it was start game with this recourse cost and 1 hour dried time you cant make a pali for protect you without claim or it will be destroy in 1 hour.

[MightySheep]

3 types of fraction here
1) trade faction with huge amount of resourse, without good online on their warriors. This fraction want to spaming they resourses for winning.
2) raiders from begining of the world that kill newbies a lot and didnt spend time on rise quality. This fraction want to destroy top village and get top resourses while the village sleep in 12 hours after patch. (MightySheep)
3) village with fighters. That fraction want to get time of attack and then came and rect.

2 type of fraction in this thread:

- nubs who want to suggest ideas to make raiding impossible because they hate fun and hate pvp
- people who actually want raiding to be viable

10 min dry time on catapult, is the only justifiable nerf imo. This stops hit and run tactic, not that it would be very effective in the first place. Since people have pointed out how easy it is to know when you are being raided, especially with custom client alerts. Once people are aware that they are being raided they will be constantly on the look out, 10 mins is more than enough time for a wary on-guard village to notice your presence.

[iamah]

IMO limit siege to every other weekend. This way you can plan your real life around the game: traveling, studying, etc. Gives time to renew your energies too and coordinate help which result in better fights. IMO gives a longer lifespan to the game since you can rest and do other stuff.